Focus on the Family with Jim Daly

Preview:

Brant Hansen: “The Lord is my Shepherd. I lack nothing.” That’s literally what it says, Psalm 23:1. You rehearse that in your head. I don’t la- I lack nothing. You can tell yourself that every day, and then it ends with, “Surely Your goodness and love will follow me all the days of my life, and I’ll dwell in the house of the Lord forever.”

End of Preview

John Fuller: Well, that’s Brant Hansen, and he’s our guest today on Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. Thanks for joining us. I’m John Fuller.

Jim Daly: John, it’s always good to have Brant on the program with us. It’s always fresh, and I just love the way he gets into topics that are relevant, that people care about. Uh, whether you’re a mom or dad and husband and wife, and it fits right in the wheelhouse for Focus on the Family.

John: Mm-hmm.

Jim: We, we do this for one reason. First, we want you to have a relationship with Christ, ’cause that’s the foundation for all. Then secondly, have a great family experience. I mean, I think the Lord created family, uh, not to drag us down. (laughs) Probably to teach us about being selfless. I love that thought in marriage, you know, the idea of the institution of marriage is not how to build me up, but how to become more selfless more spouse, how about that?

John: Mm-hmm.

Jim: More like how Christ is for us, right?

John: Yeah, yeah.

Jim: So this is why we hit these topics, and Brant does a wonderful job with great stories to help, uh, bring this to the surface.

John: He does, and he is a, a radio host. He’s syndicated on, uh, hundreds of radio stations. He’s written a number of books, and we’re talking today about one, uh, that covers, uh, so much great material. If you missed last time, uh, the first part of our conversation, get the mobile app, uh, stop by our website, uh, find the links. Uh, get a hold of that first day of content. There’s so much there. Uh, the book is called Life is Hard. God is Good. Let’s Dance.: Experiencing Real Joy in a World Gone Mad. We’ve got the details for you at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.

Jim: Brant, welcome back to Focus.

Brant: Thank you, I love it.

Jim: I always shorten it, you know, Focus. Focus on the Family, I should be saying.

Brant: Yeah, well, I think people know that. Yeah.

Jim: (laughs) Uh, we promised listeners last time, and if people haven’t heard it, uh, get the app or go to the website and download the program and you’ll hear part one.

John: Mm-hmm.

Jim: It was really good. We talked about a lot of the social pressure of, of just being riddled with fear and anxiety.

John: Mm-hmm.

Jim: And how to do some things to kinda overcome that. But today, one of the things we promised to talk about was being able to laugh at yourself.

John: Mm-hmm.

Jim: And I think, you know, it’s, could you imagine, think of Caiaphas, the high priest, and how Jesus was trying to deal with him. Do you think Caiaphas ever really laughed at himself? That’s not the image I get of Caiaphas.

Brant: Mm-mm.

Jim: Maybe it’s wrong, but, eh, people that can laugh at themselves usually are pretty healthy people.

Brant: I think so. I’ve heard that people who struggle with narcissism can’t laugh at themselves.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: And so I wanna be not that.

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: And I think making a practice of not taking yourself too seriously is a much more fun way to go through life. Like, there’s much less pressure.

Jim: Yeah, thinking of a fun way to go through life, didn’t you have a motorcycle example that you were able to laugh at yourself?

Brant: Oh, yeah.

Jim: I had one that I cried, but I didn’t laugh.

Brant: At the time, I tried to laugh about it. This is, this, see, this whole book is full of cringe stories.

John: (laughs)

Brant: For, of me.

John: Yeah.

Brant: It’s like, my friends are like, “Weird stuff just keeps happening to you.”

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: Like, “Yeah.”

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: Even in the moment, I’m like, “This is gonna be a good story.” And I thought of that. I was Indonesia to do tsunami relief years ago. It was right after it happened. A guy left me with a motorcycle. He said I could use it as he took off. And I was, it was with a crowd of people was around in a parking lot at a hotel in Banda Aceh, and I said, “I don’t wanna do that. I, I’m not good at motorcycles.”

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: “No, no, no, take it. I want you to.”

“No, I don’t want to.” I told him, like, four times. It’s like, “No, go ahead.” I got on. I kept doing the clutch gas thing wrong.

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: And I kept killing it. I felt embarrassed. And all these guys are gathered around watching me kill this engine, I’m like-

Jim: That’s terrible.

Brant: Right.

Jim: Tested your masculinity.

Brant: I, so I’m like, “I gotta do this.” I hadn’t slept in a long, so I just traveled. I’d been traveling, like, 39 hours.

Jim: (laughs) So you haven’t had any sleep.

Brant: I’m tired.

Jim: Okay.

Brant: I gunned that thing on accident, and it took off across the parking lot. I did a wheelie, and it was out of control, and I smashed into a parked truck.

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: And I went over the bike ’cause by the… I tried to pull the bike down. Sent myself flying over it, and I dented the truck with my face.

Jim: Oh my goodness.

Brant: I know. And I try to make a joke out of it.

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: ‘Cause-

Jim: I thought you looked more handsome.

Brant: Well, thank you, yeah. See? It helped.

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: And I got out of the, I got off the ground. I saw the dent, and I said, “Yeah, for my next trick, I’ll…” And I remember losing consciousness after I did that.

Jim: (laughs)

John: Oh my word.

Jim: Only guys can relate to this.

Brant: No, I just, I just telescoped to the ground. Just went to the ground.

Jim: Oh my gosh.

Brant: Like, was out. When I was coming to, I just heard all these voices and yelling, and it was the guy who owned the truck wanting money from me.

John: Oh my… (laughs)

Brant: And the whole crowd was gathered around. I came back there a week later on my way out, or, like, 10 days later. And there’s still all these guys, and they made this little motion with their hand, accelerator, to go, “Oh, vroom, vroom, vroom, vroom.”

Jim: Oh. (laughs)

Brant: (laughs)

Jim: They have T-shirts now.

Brant: Right? (laughing) I’m a legend. That’s the last time I’ve ever been on a motorcycle.

Jim: Brant Hansen, Evil Knievel.

Brant: Right, but there’s just stuff like that. It’s, it’s cringe, but on the other hand, it’s, it’s all right if I look dumb. It’s all right. It’s a good story. Who cares? Like-

Jim: You know, Brant, one thing that’s so true about human interaction, uh, people like hanging with people that do this.

Brant: Right.

Jim: You can, you, you know, laugh at yourself. Don’t take yourself too seriously. Um, it’s interesting that that is an attractive aspect of some people, you know?

Brant: It is. And it’s, everybody’s so worked up and anxious in our culture. They’re sick with anxiety. And to have somebody who’s not anxious, can laugh about stuff, it’s actually compelling.

Jim: I think you say when you describe yourself, you describe yourself as an introvert.

Brant: Totally.

Jim: So that’s got to be even more difficult.

Brant: Yeah. It is.

Jim: You know? ‘Cause you’re thinking a lot. You think quietly.

Brant: You’re self-conscious.

Jim: Right.

Brant: But there’s, there are things, I think, in life as you, as you grow with God, where you do take yourself less seriously. You realize not everything depends on you, honestly. You don’t, you don’t control very much, you really don’t.

Jim: You have a quote in the book, I think from Anne Lamott, I think it is.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: And she says, “Peace is joy at rest, and joy is peace on its feet.”

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: Wow, that’s a good statement.

Brant: I love that. That’s the, so, the Let’s Dance thing in the title, from the book, at the CURE Hospitals I get the visit in Niger, Thursday afternoons, there’s a dance party, and it’s exactly what you’re talking about, about, because it’s all kids who have disabilities, have been rejected their whole lives. They might be five-years-old, they might be 15, 17. They’ve got different levels of disability, but they’re in different places of healing at the hospital. And they turn on the music, and some kids are on, in their wheelchairs. Some are just using canes. Some you have to hold, but you just, everybody’s dancing. And it’s like this joyous thing that God is there, and they’re finding healing in the midst of one of the toughest places in the world to be a kid. These are all rejected people. But to your point, there’s no party as much fun as when no one’s trying to be cool.

Jim: Yeah, right. (laughs)

Brant: Right?

Jim: Totally.

Brant: And when you do become, like, like, the birds of the air, you’re not thinking about next week.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: Next year, what could happen, potential threats, like, that frees you up to have, actually have some fun.

Jim: You know, Brant, not everyone’s gonna have the great experience, like, with Cure or any other relief agency that’s overseas doing something. Some will. But you have a story about a neighbor, Joey, who you reached out to. And my point in that is it doesn’t have to be, like, next month when we go to Africa to do something, or whatever that might be.

Brant: Right.

Jim: It’s today with your neighbor.

Brant: So-

Jim: Describe Joey.

Brant: So, Joey is a, got a great personality, but he’s, he’s got brain injuries, and he’s a, he’s an adult. A-

Jim: Lives with his parents?

Brant: Yeah. Single, not a believer. And he always tried to make friends in the community. He was very outgoing. Extremely outgoing. Eh, some people had a hard time understanding him or why he was so extroverted or whatever. I was drawn to him, um, so we would start hanging out and doing music and stuff. ‘Cause he’d like to sing, so I’d play guitar, and it was a blast. But then he found out his parents were moving, and he had to move with him. And so my wife and I, this is not normal for us. So if you’re hearing this story, and you’re like, “Oh, you guys are just the party people,” we’re not. We’re not.

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: But, we become more so because you can take risks, and, and do it joyfully, it’s really fun. So we said to him, “We want the have a going away party for ya at our house.”

Jim: For the neighborhood.

Brant: For him, yeah, invite neighbors.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: We’ll get on the neighborhood Facebook page, invite people. We didn’t know if anybody’d come. And, uh, we made sure we had our direct neighbors come, so at least somebody came. So they came after about a half hour. No one’s there, then a mom and her daughter came. We had streamers up, balloons, all the food. And he was fine with it. I’m like, “Well, that’s cool.” But then some other neighbors came, and then some more neighbors with a couple kids. And the place was jammed. And his parents were there. They came in, in shock. And like, “We didn’t know he had friends.”

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: “Like this.” It’s like, “Well, people love you.” Like, and they’re not believers.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: But we had this conversation after the party, where she wanted to know, she’s like, “So you’re like God people, right? Like, this is-”

Jim: This is Mom.

Brant: Yeah, she’s like, “Maybe the stuff he’s went through, he’s gone through, maybe it’s for a reason. Maybe people are actually, they actually love him.”

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: It’s like, “Right. But we, that wouldn’t have happened if we didn’t step out on a limb.”

Jim: Or to create a space for that to occur.

Brant: Yes, but you have to be willing-

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: … that something may not go well. It may not end that way. You may have, I call it an experiment. You label everything an experiment, and then if it fails, like, “Well, okay, we learned something.”

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: But we’ve thrown parties for our lawn-care people that come through the neighborhood.

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: Like, turn on the, the music from where they’re from. They’re-

Jim: That’s so good.

Brant: They’re all from Guatemala, and, and we bought food, had a big party. Again, our neighbors are driving by like, “What in the world is going on with these people?”

Jim: (laughs) That’s good. Something I saw on YouTube was, uh, just somebody who set up snacks and drinks for UPS and Amazon drivers and all of that.

Brant: That’s brilliant.

Jim: And it looks like a little mini shop.

Brant: That’s brilliant.

John: Yeah.

Jim: And then there’s like 14 snacks they can choose from.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: And about 14 different drinks. And I said to Jean, I sent it to her and said, “We should do this.” She goes, “Absolutely.”

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: “We’ll start today.”

Brant: That’s great.

Jim: And so, I mean, it’s just something fun to do.

Brant: So, I, I was gonna say brilliant one more time, ’cause it’s really brilliant. I really love that idea. And, um, but, that little thing. You think it’s a little thing, it’s not.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: Especially in this culture-

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: … what if we were known for being people who weren’t anxious? If we were actually known for making outsiders feel like insiders? Because that’s what hospitality actually is.

Jim: Right, and it ties into another quote, I was gonna have you comment on it. From Eugene Peterson, who is a great friend, and he and I were, we were able to spend some time together, and what a terrific theologian.

Brant: Mm-hmm.

Jim: And, uh, he wrote about how we should be known as Christians, and I think he captured it well. He basically said, “Some people see Christianity as, as stiff, uptight life, or religion, and others see it as a dancing, leaping daring life of joy and fun and peace.” Man, that’s what we should be known for.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: Um-

Brant: Well, my goodness. The opportunity here is vast.

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: Because-

Jim: We are underperforming. (laughs)

Brant: Well, yeah, right, but also our culture is so not this.

Jim: Right. Oh, that’s for sure.

Brant: We would, we would stand out like a city on a hill or something. Like, we would, we would be like a lamp on a lamp stand, if we were the people who were anxious and angry, because we knew more about the goodness of God.

Jim: You have a philosophy that, um, hopeful Christians attract people to Christ. That’s so true. I mean, that’s scriptural, actually. “He who has vision has hope.” And people are attracted to hope.

Brant: Well, they’re supposed to ask about it. ‘Cause, literally, I used to think there’s that scripture about, “Be sure to have a ready answer.” And I used to think that was about apologetics. Like, “If somebody asks you about, you know, what do you think about the age of the Earth,” or something- That’s not what it says. It’s, “When they ask about the hope that you have in-”

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Brant: They want reasons for your hopefulness.

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Brant: That we should be so weirdly hopeful, even right now, in the midst of all of our cultural whatever, that people would say, “What’s up with that? Why are you so hopeful?” I mean, I don’t think that’s a common thing right now, but it could be.

Jim: Yeah. You use a illustration in the book, Life is Hard. God is Good. Let’s Dance., from a movie that I love, actually, Shawshank Redemption.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: There’s so much in that film that’s good.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: Uh, w- what was the scene that caught your attention?

Brant: Oh, the scene where they’re out in the, in the prison yard, and everything’s gray.

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Brant: Everything’s gray.

Jim: Their clothing, the yard.

Brant: Everything. The sky, the buildings.

Jim: Buildings.

Brant: It was just, and Andy commandeers the PA system and puts-

Jim: One of the inmates.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: And puts Mozart, an opera, on. And it’s going out on the PA outside, something beautiful just broke through. Everybody just stops. All these prisoners look up, like grace, like something beautiful just broke through all of this. And I do feel like that’s what happens. The slightest thing, where you’re actually being, uh, like, radically hospitable, is so different. It cuts through like a, a bolt from the blue. So I love that image ’cause I think that’s, that’s who we could be right now in our culture.

Jim: Yeah. Boy, that sounds good.

John: This is Focus on the Family with Jim Daly, and I’m John Fuller. Our guest today is Brant Hansen, and we’re exploring some of the themes in his book, Life is Hard. God is Good. Let’s Dance.: Experiencing Real Joy in a World Gone Mad. And, uh, we’ll encourage you to get a copy from us here. Uh, our number’s 800, the letter A, and the word FAMILY. Or stop by focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.

Jim: You know, we’re jumping to various stories because you’ve mentioned them in here. There was a woman’s softball team. And again, this is the, the truth of scripture.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: It’s just right in front of us.

Brant: Right.

Jim: If we stop and see it.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: What happened in this press conference with this softball team?

Brant: This is amazing. You can look it up on YouTube or whatever. It was Oklahoma. They’d won like 57 games in a row.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: Three national titles at this time. The ESPN reporter said, not knowing anything about these players. I didn’t either.

Jim: Right.

Brant: Said, “So how do you keep the joy going? You know, you’ve got all this pressure on ya.” And sequentially, down the line at this press conference, each one of these softball-playing young women had the most profound theological statements about joy. They’re like, “Oh, you want to talk about joy?” Like, “We know that our significance doesn’t come from softball, it comes from knowing who Jesus is. We know this.” And the second went, I paraphrase, I mean, said, “You know, let me piggyback on what she said. That allows us to be good at what we do because we’re playing more loose.”

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Brant: “Because our entire identity doesn’t rest on softball. We know that even if we lose, we’ll be okay. Ultimately, we have each other, and we’re safe in God’s Kingdom.” And then a third one starts and said… I’m like, they’re, they’re all brilliant statements, all off the cuff. And I’m like, “I bet ESPN did not expect that to happen.”

Jim: (laughs) I bet they did not.

Brant: It was, no, they did not. But it’s so genius. And then the coach resounded with all of that too. She, she’s a believer.

Jim: Wow.

Brant: So, hearing that coming from young people, I’m like, “Man, sometimes wisdom wears a softball uniform.” It was beautiful to hear, but it’s also true. Like, this allows you, if you actually trust God, and you, your identity’s with Him, everything else isn’t quite as important. Which means you’re free to take some big swings.

Jim: Including your obstacles or your handicaps-

Brant: Absolutely.

Jim: … or whatever they might be.

Brant: Right. And you can, you can take things less seriously, which actually allows you to do your stuff better.

Jim: Yeah. You know, one of the scriptures that I feel like we’re fumbling with, uh, because it’s hard with our flesh getting in the way. But, “To love your enemies.”

Brant: Uh-huh.

Jim: That whole section of Luke. I think it’s Luke, chapter six. It’s kinda hard to read, because he’s saying, “What is it if you love people who love you?”

Brant: Right.

Jim: “Sinners do that.”

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: “I’m telling you, love those who hate you. Pray for those who hate you.” And you know, it’s really an admonition. But it is freaky-

Brant: Right.

Jim: … to love people who hate you. And the people that are mostly freaked out are the people that hate you. Like, “Why are you treating me so well?”

Brant: It’s freaky awesome.

Jim: (laughs)

Brant: It is. It is, so, that, you know, e- all the stuff Jesus says, like, “Wow, that’s really hard.” But you know what? It’s always easier than the alternative. Like, going through life bitter, going through life anxious. Going through, like, His way of living. He is, He has a way. He is the way. His way of living is lighter and more restful. Loving your enemies actually frees you mentally to concentrate on other stuff too, instead of being obsessed with anger.

Jim: Well, yeah. Brennan Manning, you quote him in the book, a theologian. He wrote, “If we dared to live beyond our self-concern, we would change the world in a few months.”

Brant: We would.

Jim: (laughs) I mean, that is, like-

Brant: People are dying for this, man.

Jim: … boom.

Brant: Yes, people are d- like, they are sick with anxiety. The way of Jesus is a way that ultimately frees us. It’s not just pressing a button. It’s not just, “Now I’m not anxious.” It’s a way of life, but over time, you become the sort of person who is less anxious.

Jim: To love your enemies, it has to start with forgiveness.

Brant: Totally.

Jim: Describe that formula, if I could call it that.

Brant: Yeah, well, forgiveness is, is letting go of your right to anger. There’s no other way, just, you can’t say, “I’m forgiving you, but I’m staying angry at you.”

Jim: Why do we like that so much?

Brant: It’s-

Jim: To hang onto that?

Brant: It’s juicy. It feels good. It-

Jim: It does.

Brant: … it appeals to our self-righteousness.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: ‘Cause we feel like we’ve got something on somebody. And again, it can be something horrific that they’ve done. Still, it’s freeing to forgive someone because what happens is, they’ll stay in your head the rest of your life.

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Brant: But that freedom allows you to have a more joyful life. Like, so, everything Jesus is telling us is actually a better way to live. So, it’s, it’s incumbent on us to help other people understand that, ’cause their life is gonna be better if they practice the way of Jesus.

Jim: Let me ask you, in order to have peace in the midst of the chaos that we’ve been describing last time and this time, uh, you say we have to be focused on the right thing. So this is kinda one of those practical questions.

Brant: Yes.

Jim: What is it to focus on the right things and what are they?

Brant: Well, first under- I want people to understand. I want me to understand, who we’re becoming is entirely dependent on what we pay attention to.

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Brant: There’s no way around that. How, you pay attention. You pay to attend with your mind, and that determines who you’re going to become. And God’s very vested in who we’re becoming. So that’s what I’m talking about, focusing on the right things. The goodness of God. Like, continuing… I’ve started memorizing scripture in the last few years.

Jim: That’s great.

Brant: Yeah, I know. I should have done it a long time ago.

Jim: It’s a lot harder the older we get. (laughs)

Brant: Yeah, it’s true. And it’s funny, ’cause I, I tell people, I, especially younger guys, I’m like, “You know the most punk rock thing you can do in this culture is memorize scripture.”

Jim: (laughs) That’s good.

Brant: Right? ‘Cause a s-

Jim: Counter culture.

Brant: So counter-cultural, but also-

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: … they can’t take it from ya, man.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: It’s in your head. No matter where you are, you can rehearse that. “The Lord is my Shepherd. I lack nothing.” That’s literally what it says. Psalm 23:1. You rehearse that in your head. I don’t la- I lack nothing. You can tell yourself that every day, and then it ends with, “Surely Your goodness and love will follow me all the days of my life, and I’ll dwell in the House of the Lord forever.” Well, I’ve got that memorized, and it reminds me, the other shoe’s not gonna drop. Sometimes you feel like God’s gonna get you in the end. “Surely, Your goodness and love will follow me all the days of my life, and then I’ll dwell in Your house forever.” Well, you tell me that doesn’t affect your anxiety level? “I lack nothing because You’re my Shepherd, and surely, You’re never going to drop the other…” That helps. That’s a pretty s- we’re playing from a really strong hand, and we don’t realize it, I think.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: That we’re actually way more safe than we realize.

Jim: You know, Brant, let me ask you a real practical question because we’re in, you know, we’re in a democracy. You look at the political arena.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: And I, I just do not like going to DC. I don’t feel like it’s a, a healthy place.

Brant: It’s not uplifting.

Jim: Not uplifting. It’s conflict.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: It’s the kingdom in conflicts.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: And so when, when you look at it, how do we manage that as Christians to be engaged? How do we not become overwhelmed? We’re going into a political season with state elections, federal elections, judges, all of it. It can be a bit overwhelming, and, and of course, we’re looking at it through a biblical landscape, and we’re going, “People that don’t get it, they’re just, what are they thinking?”

Brant: Yeah. I know.

Jim: And how do you, how do you-

Brant: Couple things.

Jim: … manage it?

Brant: Number one, remind yourself of that thing about, it’s, it’s a spiritual battle. We still have to love these people, but are, there is a spiritual battle that’s quite real. So reminding ourselves of that. I think it’s actually helpful.

Another thing, when you’re watching the news, it’s okay to be informed, but if I’m not memorizing scripture, if I’m not practicing God’s presence in my life, I’m going to be a nervous wreck.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: So, we’re gonna have to double, triple down. There’s a lot of older Christians I think they’re, are very anxious. And that’s too bad.

Jim: ‘Cause things, seemingly, are slipping away, you know?

Brant: Well, we understand-

Jim: Foundations.

Brant: But in Jesus’ time, He’s talking to people that, they don’t have food security.

Jim: Right.

Brant: They don’t have antibiotics. They’re occupied by the Romans. There’s factionalism going on, there’s racism happening. there’s infanticide happening. There’s all this stuff happening, and He’s still saying, “You don’t have to be anxious.” He knows how this ends, remember?

Jim: (laughs) Right.

Brant: He’s there, and He’s telling us, “I know how this ends. You can be of good cheer. I’ve overcome the world.” That’s a pretty, again, a strong place for us to actually be, but if you’re just consuming news, and you’re not going deep, and I’m not going, then I’m gonna be an anxious wreck. There’s no doubt about it. No question.

Jim: One of the things that you encourage us is to take a lesson from Job in responding to the hardships and trials. Are you serious? Have you read that story?

Brant: (laughs) Right, you know what? I love that Job was asking a lot of, a lot of questions. Some are, aren’t so good. Some are. But he stays loyal, and in the end, there was a backstory that he didn’t know about. And in the end, he is rewarded for staying loyal. God’s, you know, goes through these, like, “Who are you to question me?” And then He rewards him.

Jim: I like that one. It’s a good-

Brant: Isn’t it?

Jim: … good response. (laughs)

Brant: Like, so I don’t have all the answers. But it’s good to know that’s God’s ultimately good.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: And there is a backstory. And He’s telling us, “In the end, this turns out well.”

Jim: Yeah. I think right at the end here, Brant, the last obvious question is, how, for people that are struggling to do this, espe- believers, how do we find peace in Christ?

Brant: Yeah. It’s gonna be actually trusting His character. I don’t have every answer, but it’s trusting His character. Think about it this way. There’s a game in the NCAA tournament. I wrote about this in the book, years ago. I’m an Illinois fan, ’cause I graduated from Illinois. They were down 15 with three minutes left against Arizona, and love you, Arizona fans. I was agitated. The refs were bad. The team was doing poorly. We should have been ahead. We were getting killed. The game is over. I told my son, who was little at the time, we might as well shut it off. And Carolyn, my wife, was like, “Quit being negative. He wants to enjoy the game with his dad.” I’m like, “This is over, but it’s over, what’s the point?” So I sat down and left it on and rolled my eyes.

Jim: (laughs) Good mom.

Brant: And they came back and won that game. And I’ve watched it on YouTube about 4,000 times since then, ’cause it’s such a great comeback.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: You know what? When I watch it on YouTube, I’m not anxious. I’m not throwing something at the TV. I’m not angry at the refs. Why? ‘Cause I know how this ends.

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Brant: Jesus literally saying, “Yes, you’re gonna have troubles. I know how this ends. It ends well. I’m telling you.” It’s actually trusting that. Do I actually trust that or not? ‘Cause if we do, that changes everything.

Jim: Well, and the inverse is true. What you’re saying, if we’re anxious and fearful, we are demonstrating our lack of trust in Him. And that, wow, when I see it in that way, that concerns my heart.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: That I would be behaving in such a way to displease Him like that.

Brant: Yeah.

Jim: But you’re not a big enough God for me to trust. Wow.

Brant: But He’s not, He’s not zapping you for that.

Jim: No, no.

Brant: He, He wants you to have a life at peace.

Jim: But it’s my attitude.

Brant: Right.

Jim: It’s my heart toward Him.

Brant: Yeah. And you’re rob-

Jim: Not His heart toward me.

Brant: You, you could have had a luch- much more fun life. Honestly, I’m asking this question, not rhetorically, but I’m asking you both. Do you think that looking back on our lives, we might look back and go, “You know what? We never actually needed to be worried about anything.”

Jim: Yeah.

John: Mm-hmm.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: In the big picture. In the big picture of things.

Jim: Mm-hmm.

Brant: I, I have a, I suspect that’s gonna happen.

Jim: Yeah.

Brant: You know what? He was right. Jesus was right.

Jim: Right.

Brant: What, what do you know?

John: Yeah.

Jim: But the good thing, and Jean often reminds me of this, when we’re in Heaven, I doubt that even the negativity of that reflection of that will be present-

Brant: No.

Jim: … because God will wipe it away from us.

Brant: I don’t think so either.

Jim: And we won’t have that sorrow, that, “Oh, we missed that.”

Brant: No, just like watching the YouTube game, man.

Jim: You know. It’d be- yeah.

Brant: Like, it’s just joy now.

Jim: “Let’s watch that again.”

Brant: It’s just joy.

Jim: (laughs) Brant, this has been so good. Thanks for coming, and thanks for spending time with us. Uh, both last time and today. Life is Hard. God is Good. Let’s Dance. Uh, what a great resource, really to refresh you about where you’re at in your journey with the Lord. And if these are concepts that you feel you struggle with, why not get some help? I love the fact that God wrote in Galatians the list. “If you’re in Me, here’s the fruit of the spirit. This is what you’re gonna see in you. Love, and joy, and peace, and others.” And if you’re not feeling that, I would get, first, read that scripture-

Brant: Mm-hmm.

Jim: … in Galatians 5:22. Secondly, get a copy of the book, uh, from Brant, Life is Hard. God is Good. Let’s Dance., ’cause it reinforces the idea that that’s all you need. And, uh, I’m so grateful for your ability to communicate this.

Brant: Thanks, man. I’m honored to be here.

Jim: So, uh, get in touch with us. Uh, make a gift of any amount, and we’ll send you a copy of the book as our way of saying thank you for participating in ministry, and you get a great resource.

John: Make a one-time gift or if you’re able, uh, sign up to be a monthly donor to Focus on the Family. Uh, we’ve got, uh, the links and details on how to do that and get a copy of this great book from Brant Hansen at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast. And next time, Family Coach Jim Burns will share some great advice for parents of adult children.

Preview:

Dr. Jim Burns: Whenever we are intrusive with giving advice, what they hear is not the lesson we’re trying to give them, what they hear is that you don’t trust them to be all grown up. Even when they’re not making good decisions, and so it’s important for us to, to understand that.

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