Kinley Pepin: I’m seven, and, um, my name’s Kinley. I wanna be a vet. I wanted to be a doctor, but I like dogs and all kinds of animals, so I wanna take care of them.
End of Teaser
Jim Daly: That is good.
John Fuller: I love that little heart. Seven years old, and Kinley is already starting to dream about what she’s going to do in life. But today on Focus on the Family, you’re gonna hear how God is already using her as a testament to His perfect plans. Your host is Focus president and author Jim Daly. I’m John Fuller.
Jim: Uh, John, everybody should look at those they love, if they can right now – your spouse, your kids. If you’re alone, look in the mirror. And what you see is something God has handcrafted. And you are made in His image for a very specific purpose. In the book of Jeremiah, God reminds us that before I formed you in the womb, I knew you. Before you were born, I set you apart. I mean, think of those words. Those are awesome words…
John: They are.
Jim: …Spoken about each one of us. And that’s why here at Focus on the Family, we’re so passionate about affirming the value of all human life. And that’s the message of our broadcast today. It’s a story of an unplanned pregnancy, a young woman’s, uh, bravery and sacrifice, a family’s choice to adopt and a precious little girl named Kinley that you just heard from there. And, uh, we are going to have quite a discussion.
John: It’s an incredible story. And our guests are a mother and daughter pair. Uh, we have, uh, Scarlet Pepin and her daughter, Lindsay Pepin Ophus. And they’ve written a book together called Joy Will Come: Exchange Shame for Redemption. And, uh, you can find out more about the book and get a copy at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.
Jim: Lindsay and Scarlet, welcome to Focus on the Family.
Lindsay Pepin Ophus: Hi. Thanks for having us.
Jim: It is great.
Scarlet Pepin: We’re glad to be here.
Jim: Yeah. We’re so glad you’re here. And thank you for the courage in writing the book and – and your willingness to speak. You speak often on this topic and what, uh, God has led you through. And so, we’re grateful for that. Lindsay, let me start with you. You were a senior in high school, and everything was going smoothly, right?
Lindsay: Mm hmm. Yes.
Jim: Pretty much.
Jim: But you had a bit of a secret going on. And this is so good for all of us Christian parents to hear. Um, and I – again, I especially appreciate your willingness to talk about this. And there’s no shame.
Jim: There’s only going forward and correcting errors and seeking forgiveness…
Jim: …From the Lord and those you love. And so, I hope you feel that today.
Jim: It’s already got me in tears here.
Jim: But, um, know that and…
Lindsay: Thank you.
Jim: …As we unfold your story. But what was that secret? What was going on?
Lindsay: Yeah. So, like you said, I grew up in a – in a seemingly perfect family. I had the all – all the cards stacked in my favor. Um, you know, I – I was blessed with the best parents. I went to church every Sunday. Um, but my big secret was that I was sleeping with my boyfriend. So, I had been dating someone on and off for about five years, and, um, we were making decisions in our relationship that I knew weren’t right. And, um, I felt the weight and the guilt of that, and I tried to go to God consistently. But I got to the point where I just felt so shameful and so dirty and so – you know, I just kept feeling that gap of I can’t go back. I can’t go back to God. He cannot fix this. I’m too dirty. I’m too messy to go to the cross, so I need to figure this out on my own.
Lindsay: And when we get to that point where we’re – we’re gonna figure it out on our own, that’s when we’re really in some trouble. So…
Jim: Wow. I mean, phew, you have really prayed this through, thought this through.
Jim: I mean, you’re articulate on this. I can’t wait because there’s so many directions here. I’m already poppin’. My head’s full of questions.
Jim: An obvious one, you know, with such a good, stable environment, uh, why? Because, you know, we as parents, I’ve got – I’ve got two teenage boys. And I’m sittin’ there, goin’, “We’re hoping we’ve done everything right.”
Jim: I’m sure, like your mom and dad – we’re gonna hear from you in a minute, Mom…
Jim: …But, um, I’m sure they were, you know, approaching that formula and thinking, “OK, we’ve got all the boxes checked.”
Jim: She knows the Lord. She, um, prays before bed.
Jim: She prays with us at mealtime. She’s going through the family devotional together.
Jim: But still, there was that area of your life. Can you – can you tell us why?
Lindsay: Yeah, I think that’s the number 1 question I get from Christian parents, is why.
Lindsay: Why did it not work out? What happened there?
Jim: Well, because we as parents, we’re performance oriented.
Jim: So, we’re thinking we’ve done all the right laps. We’ve done all the right things.
Lindsay: Yeah, definitely.
Jim: And we’re – we’re, like, stunned.
Lindsay: Right. And they did do all the right things. That was the thing. And, you know…
Jim: So, it’s not about us, maybe.
Lindsay: It – and that was the biggest thing.
Lindsay: That’s the number 1 thing I say, is your children make decisions that are their decisions. And as parents, you have to remember that you can’t take on their decisions is a reflection of, “Oh, well, I messed up. I did this. I did that.” They’re humans. They’re budding adults. They’re making new decisions. They’re testing out the waters. They’re trying out new things. Um, so that’s – that’s the first and foremost, is, parents, your children will make decisions that go against everything that you’ve taught them. And that’s just life.
Jim: Right. Let’s go to that day. And it’s – Scarlet, we’re really gonna get you in here, but I wanna hear from Lindsay first. Um, let’s go to that day when you actually found out you’re pregnant. What – what was the environment like?
Jim: What was the setting? And what did you hear, and how did you respond?
Lindsay: Yeah. So, um, it was kind of a threefold finding out. Um, you know, I took a pregnancy test. It came back negative. Um…
Jim: How old are you?
Lindsay: I am at this point – I am newly 18.
Lindsay: So, I was a – I was an older senior, but, um, newly 18. I took a pregnancy test, came back negative. Phew, dodged a bullet. OK, we’re good. Um, multiple days went by, and I still did not start my period so then I took another pregnancy test, and this one turned positive as soon as it got wet. So, it was – it was ready to go. So, it was positive, and it was, “Oh, my goodness. What’s going on? This can’t be right. You know, I’ve had a negative. Now I’ve had a positive. I need to go and get this checked.” So, um, the first thing I think of is, “I can’t go to my pediatrician. They’re gonna call my mom, so I – I need to go somewhere else.” So, um, the only place I knew to go was Planned Parenthood. So that is where I went. Um, I went. I filled out paperwork. I filled out all the information and the whole time thinking, “There’s no way this is my life. There is no way this is happening. I’m a Pepin. Pepins don’t get pregnant. Pepins don’t go to Planned Parenthood. Pepins don’t have these scenarios. This – this isn’t happening.”
Jim: Mom, Scarlet.
Jim: OK. The mom’s listening, or going, “When is Mom gonna talk?”
Scarlet: Yeah (laughter).
Jim: But let’s hear your heart. Um, how did that go down when Lindsay came home, I’m assuming…
Jim: But you paint the picture.
Jim: What was that discussion like when she said, “OK…”
Jim: “…I’m pregnant.”
Scarlet: So, we thought we kinda had the ducks in a row as far as parenting. And nothing was perfect in our eyes, but everything seemed to be going on track. So, it was a Saturday morning and, um, one of those just easygoing mornings. And my – Lindsay sits down at the kitchen table, says, “What do you guys have planned?” And I said, “Oh, I think we’re gonna head to Home Depot.”
Scarlet: It was that casual.
Jim: Sounds like a Saturday morning (laughter).
Scarlet: Oh, just a Saturday morning. We – you know, my husband had…
Jim: The to-do list (laughter).
Scarlet: Yes. My husband had made pancakes, just a normal feeling…
Scarlet: …Saturday morning. And at that point, we say, “Home Depot.” And Lindsay’s head hits the breakfast table like a rag doll. I mean, her long hair’s hanging down. And a sound came out of my daughter I have never heard. It was in between a moan and, um, a wail. And to hear that sound from your child was very much a panic “What is wrong? What is wrong?” And she’s sobbing and can’t get the words out. Um, my husband said his first thought was, “Did she hit someone with the car last night?”
Scarlet: Like, it was that much of a emotional reaction that we…
Jim: Some big wrong.
Jim: But that caught him. Like, something bad happened.
Scarlet: Oh, yes. It was a we’ve gotta help our kid. What is going on?
Scarlet: And she said two words that I never saw coming. Absolutely. I could not believe that these words came out of her mouth. And they were just two words. And it was, “I’m pregnant.” And my first reaction was, I’ve gotta leave the room. If I leave the room, that means this scene didn’t just happen. And so, something happens psychologically. You’re not thinking it through. But it was like, I – you know, maybe it’s fight or flight.
Scarlet: But it was like, maybe if I run or get out of this room, then my life is different than what just happened (laughter).
Jim: You know…
Scarlet: Really an odd feeling.
Jim: This is really important because there are some listening that either this just happened to or it’s about to happen to.
Jim: And I wanna make sure parents hear this really clearly. This is the moment of truth. Um, how you react in this moment could very easily set the relationship with your child for the rest of your life.
Scarlet: Yes. That’s a great point.
Jim: What did you do?
Scarlet: But when it was happening, I didn’t realize I was setting that (laughter). You’re just – in fact, it’s almost a – first thing is a little bit of a selfishness. Your first thought is, “How did this happen, um, on my watch?” You know, hate to make it all about me, but that’s…
Jim: But guilt. Guilt?
Scarlet: …The first reaction. Guilt, absolute guilt.
Scarlet: And I said…
Jim: What will my friends say?
Scarlet: I wasn’t that far along in the thinking…
Scarlet: …Because you’re too much in a panic of those words didn’t just come out. And so, my first, I think, sentence – well, first, I said, “No,” as in this can’t be true. And then the next thing that came out was “I would have helped you.” So, it went to guilt immediately.
Lindsay: Yeah. She just kept screaming, “No, no,” and then, “I could’ve helped you. I could’ve helped you,” and kept getting in – like, even leaning into my face, “I could’ve helped you.” And it was this complete panic as my dad’s banging his fist on the table.
Jim: So that’s what – that was your dad…
Lindsay: Yeah, he went to anger.
Lindsay: “Who did this? How did this happen? When did this happen?” Wanting all the facts and banging his fists. And I’m just a – a puddle, just, sorry, I’m sorry, I’m sorry, I’m sorry, and just couldn’t – couldn’t – you’re watching – you just created this tornado. You crushed your parents’ feelings and their hopes. And they’re in complete, utter shock and panic. And you’re the source of all of it. So much instant shame and guilt.
Jim: So how did – either one of you, how did you process the next 10 minutes, 30 minutes, hour, day? I mean, what…
Lindsay: Day would be accurate. (laughter) Yeah.
Jim: What – what was that like. What were – OK, how do I get my balance? How do you come back to the room?
Scarlet: Yeah. So that day we – I remember we went – Brad, my husband, got right, you know – OK, we’re sitting down. I wanna hear everything. I wanna hear where you were. I wanna hear when it happened. I wanna hear – remember? He would say…
Lindsay: Oh, yeah (laughter).
Scarlet: Give me location.
Lindsay: Do I remember? Yeah.
Scarlet: I need – it was just, how could you?
Jim: He was down to data.
Scarlet: Oh, he was down to data and – and logic…
Scarlet: …And that, um, through his pain. The other part that played an interesting point, uh, or part of this, is that we had an eighth-grade daughter at that point. And she – well, we still have her, but now she’s all grown.
Scarlet: But anyway, so in eighth grade, she had never, you know, even thought, you know – maybe thought about it – but never kissed a boy or held hands or anything like that.
Scarlet: And so, to watch that child too, as a parent, she is just devastated because she’s hugging my husband. And she goes – she told me later, “I could feel Dad shaking. I’ve never felt my big dad shake, you know?” And so, to watch her and the anger that she put towards Lindsay on how could you do this to us, I mean, it really became a – how could you, Lindsay – her quote was, “We’re the Pepin girls.” So, it kinda…
Jim: That meant something to you.
Lindsay: Oh, yeah.
Jim: I mean, not everybody would have that, but there was a standard that you felt.
Lindsay: A thousand percent. A – our last name carried so much weight on who we were. We were a unit. We were the Pepin family. And the Pepin family had standards and responsibilities and, you know, upheld certain values. And – and I think a lot of that came to a lot of my shame and a lot of my hiding and a lot of my guilt was, like, I’ve ruined the family name. Like, I’ve tarnished who we are as a unit. And it was – it wasn’t, you know, oh, well, you know, Lindsay’s pregnant. You know, the rest of the family’s gonna move on. I mean, it shattered our whole family.
Scarlet: Think we were just so tight knit. And I didn’t feel as a parent that we were trying to hold up a name. But our kids did.
Jim: Wow. That’s interesting.
Scarlet: That’s kind of clueless (laughter).
John: This is Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. And you can find the book – and you can find this story captured in the book Joy Will Come: Exchange Shame for Redemption, written by our guests, Lindsay Pepin Ophus and Scarlett Pepin. And, uh, we’ve got copies of that and other help. In fact, we have a counseling team. If you’re finding yourself identifying with the crisis moments that they’re describing, uh, that’s all at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast. Or give us a call. Uh, our number is 800, the letter A and the word FAMILY.
Jim: Scarlet, let me – let me tap into something I think you just mentioned, um – in – specifically in the book Joy Will Come. You talk about the scrapbook analogy.
Jim: Um, because I think a lot of moms are going to identify with…
Jim: …Especially Christian moms. I’m thinking my wife, Jean. And, you know, they’re just trying so hard to be perfect.
Jim: You know, so you scrapbook, and you get the pages and the pictures.
Scarlet: Yes (laughter).
Jim: And you’ve got them on the wall.
Jim: And you’re paying $14 million a page to do that scrapbooking, by the way…
Jim: …Which us husbands go, “What? How much are we paying for a scrapbook?”
Scarlet: Yes, yes.
Jim: But I get it. And, I mean, so many of the listeners understand that, too.
Scarlet: Yes. So, I would say probably my number 1 job in my life that I felt responsible for was being a great mom – a great wife, too. But this motherhood thing was – it was the most important thing to me, I feel like. Um, and so the scrapbook analogy was just a feeling of, here I’ve been handed this little girl, Lindsay, you know, 18 years before and put bows in her hair and taught her to brush her teeth and taught her about Jesus and memorized her love languages and tried to get it all down just right. And then you turn the page, and they’re growing up. And she’s doing – you know, taking her to Sunday school and enjoying who she is. But I felt like I got to the point where – she announced she was pregnant within that next week. I felt like I had left my whole project out in the rain. It was almost like I had grabbed my scrapbook – figuratively, you know, as an analogy here – that Lindsay’s life – now what? And not that I was labeling her as the pregnant teenager. But now what? The plans for, OK, do they get married? Is she gonna get married? Is she gonna go off to college? You know, I had things kind of going down – down the road that I thought was – was great. You know, like, um, – their – first grade, they hold up the sign – this is what we do in Tulsa anyway. They hold up the sign in front of the front door – first grade. You get their picture. Second grade – their picture.
Jim: (laughter) Right.
Scarlet: And you’re watching them grow.
Scarlet: But I didn’t picture senior year pregnant. That just didn’t ever cross my mind.
Scarlet: And so, the scrapbook analogy is just kind of seeing those pages look like all the dreams I had for her.
Jim: Well, and to go a little further in that direction, uh, you had that startling realization that maybe you had made idols out of your kids.
Jim: Speak to this because so many moms are gonna say, that’s me.
Scarlet: Yes. And I will tell you I did not know that. That’s what’s so interesting.
Jim: Define it, though, ’cause moms don’t know…
Scarlet: Yes, yeah.
Jim: How much they idolize their kids.
Scarlet: Idolize their kids. Yes. And it’s all for a good cause, we think. You know, that’s a good thing to be a loving mom. But even good things can become an idol. They’re almost sneakier that way, I think.
Jim: What’s that boundary line? I mean, you’re saying it, but help me. I don’t quite get it. When do I cross the line to creating an idol out of my child?
Scarlet: When I look back at it, I think it came down to I love God. I love the Lord. I’m spending time, you know, in the Bible. But if my kid has a school project, I will get back to God (laughter). In other words, I gotta stay up until 3 a.m. to get this school project done when in my heart and in my spirit, I can feel the Lord drawing me to, “Hey, come away with Me. Let’s spend some time together.” And the only way I can explain it is – you’re reading the Word. You’re spending time with the Lord. You’re putting Him first. Also, it unraveled some of my identity. I’m a good mom. So, um, that was part of my identity. Um, these kids – you can make them all about them, especially, I think, in our society now. Um, Instagram and all the postings, and they have their own hashtags, and I’m not – I’m not slamming on anybody, but I think as mamas, we need to be real careful, um, because nothing can come before our relationship with the Lord.
Jim: Yeah. This, uh, this area – I’m gonna ask a couple of really sensitive questions. And I appreciate your honesty toward each other. You’ve obviously gone through this and processed it, so I’m not shocking you by this. But, um, Lindsay, you say the pressure to be the perfect Christian girl made you vulnerable. All of us parents just went “What? What?” ‘Cause we don’t – we’re not grabbing that.
Jim: And looking back, was there anything anyone could’ve done differently? And what set you up? You use this story in the book about giving the stars for achievement. That’s something we’ve talked about here at Focus a lot.
Scarlet: Mmm hmm. Yes.
Lindsay: (laughter) Mmm hmm.
Jim: You know, we think that’s a good thing.
Jim: You know, put a star when you hit the mark, and you do your chores, and that’s a good thing. How did the star chart play into this…
Jim: …About this idea of perfection?
Lindsay: Yeah. I think really what it boiled down to was, um, there were such a standard and there was such a place that you had to achieve. You had to get all your check marks. You had to get all your stars to be the good daughter. And there was rewards – if you do this, then you get this reward. If you do this – if you don’t do that, you don’t get your star. You don’t get your reward. So, it felt like my love with my parents was tingent on if I met all the check marks. If I did everything right, my parents would love me. And then it went back to – at church, “Well, are you guys reading your Bibles every morning? Are you praying every morning? Are you -” Well, if I don’t read my Bible this morning, then God doesn’t love me today. And I started to really interpret it – if I don’t hit all the check marks in every area of my life, then I am unlovable. And so when I started to believe those lies and get into that isolation, then when I started to make decisions out of – well, I’m not gonna be perfect anyway, so I might as well do whatever I want, and I kind of moved – kind of swung a little too far, it became…
Jim: Because you couldn’t hit the mark.
Lindsay: Yeah. There was a – there was a – I couldn’t hit the mark. I could never achieve, so I’ll just go ahead and swing. This person seems to love me, so we’ll go ahead and swing this way. And then it turns into, well, now everybody thinks I’m still getting all my check marks, so I can’t go get help. I can’t go to the church because they think I’m a good Christian girl. If they only knew, then God would definitely not love me. I could never show up to church. If my parents knew, they would disown me. They would never, you know, allow me to see this person anymore. It turned into – I had a facade of, yes, I’m perfect, so now I can no longer get help because there’s no authenticity in who I am.
Jim: Well, and you – you’re really on it. And again, I appreciate the thoughtfulness in which you’re saying this. And I think all of us as parents – Scarlet, don’t feel guilty. We’re all doing it.
Scarlet: Mmm hmm. Oh, I’m on the couch – I thought this – right? Yeah.
Jim: We’re all – we’re all doing it.
Jim: But on behalf of all the listeners, what can we do as parents – and really, from both of your perspectives now that you’ve learned when we’re putting the stars up there…
Jim: …And we’re giving the accolades, and we’re making it a very performance-based relationship, how do we augment that?
Jim: What could have benefited you? What would have helped you? And it’s hard with your mom sitting right here, but what – what could have been done in your opinion to help us to do a little better job of talking about God’s grace?
Lindsay: Yeah. I think the candidness. I – this is something I think about when I’m gonna be, you know, raising children in the future is, what will I – what will I personally do differently? And I think that’s the candidness of, yeah, even Mom and Dad make mistakes, even Mom and Dad sin. Yep, Mom told a lie the other day, and it really wasn’t great, and here’s how it made me feel, and here’s – you know, kind of letting your children learn from you, even when you’re, you know, being ugly and not – and in sin, let your kids see the different areas. Talk to them about what you struggled with and – and validate and make it a conversation, and here’s – you’re not isolated. I get it. I used to be a teenager. You know, having those conversations of, “Let’s be open, and let’s all talk about this.” And I think about it from a parent standpoint and even from the church standpoint. We need to be OK to say, from the pulpit, “Yeah, I’m the pastor, and I still make mistakes, and I still sin.”
Lindsay: “And I still fall short. But God’s grace is constantly there. You can always come back home.”
Lindsay: “We always have open arms.” And I think – I think just some candidness. Because, to be honest, as I’m an adult and I hear things more now about my parents and, you know, shortcomings that they’ve had in the past, it’s like, why didn’t you say something? Like, oh, my goodness. And it was crazy, when people found out I was pregnant, how many of my friends’ moms and older, you know, Christian women in my life said, “That happened to me, too.” Or, “I struggled with that, too.” Or, “I’ve walked that, too.” And I’m like, where were you when I was struggling in my sin? Why were we not having these discussions when you could have helped stop and prevent me from getting to the point where you’ve now felt that hurt, too? And so that was a long, roundabout answer, but it…
Jim: No, it’s really helpful. That authenticity is what I hear you saying.
Lindsay: Authenticity, yes.
Jim: And – and yet, you know, the thing is, we want to project this perfection.
Jim: Because we want you to live up to it.
Jim: That’s the bottom line.
Jim: Now, this is a horrible trap for you. I mean, it’s – it’s vicious.
Jim: How low did that get, bouncing between living this dual life of, “They don’t know what I’ve done or what I’m doing…”
Jim: …Which was having sex with your boyfriend…
Jim: …Versus winning the stars and doing all the things to win you accolades about your Christian life?
Jim: I mean, wow. Did you – what was your lowest point in that regard?
Lindsay: I mean, I think the leading all up to it. I mean, that was – it was something that ate me alive from the moment that I made the first decision to, you know, move into that type of relationship. I mean, it was something to where I would practice lies in the car before I got home so that I could be candid to my parents on what I actually did that night. I got to that point where I’m like, well, I have to make sure even my lies sound good, so they believe me. And I just – I mean, my self-worth was completely deteriorated. I kept having those thoughts of, Lindsay, what are you doing? This is not who you are. You need to – you know, it was the Holy Spirit – I know that now – saying to me, “Come on, girl. Like, you – you know better than this.” And then it just turned into, I’m just too far gone, that it just is what it is. There’s – there’s no saving me at this point. And I’ll just get through, you know, high school. I’ll leave my parents’ house. I’ll then live my own life, and we’ll go from there. And if I come back to God, I do. If I don’t, you know -it just was, uh – it was just rock bottom.
Jim: So, I’m sure some women are saying, “You could make this problem disappear.”
Lindsay: Yep. Yeah.
Jim: “You didn’t have to be that embarrassed girl or that embarrassed family.”
Jim: And I want to talk to you about that.
Jim: But just so we don’t leave people wondering what did you do, you did not abort the child.
Lindsay: Correct. I chose life for my daughter and placed her for adoption.
Jim: And we want to come back next time and talk about that aspect of the story because it’s equally intriguing.
Jim: Um, there’s so many elements to this. It ended up being a family member.
Jim: And we’re gonna bring her in and talk with her…
Jim: …Next time about the solution and how you guys worked through this. And here’s the question I really wanted to hit. And again, if, uh, a family has just gone through this or if you’re even unaware, Mom and Dad, you’re about to go through this, sin has a way of working itself – and for the Lord, using it for His and for our good.
Jim: That’s the thing we – we don’t always embrace. Because I’m hearing the two of you interact right now, watching you – you’re in a good place.
Lindsay: Oh, definitely.
Scarlet: Mm hmm. I think better than before the pregnancy.
Scarlet: And our – my husband, too.
Jim: But it doesn’t mean – encourage your daughter to go get pregnant.
Lindsay: Right. Don’t. Don’t.
Jim: That’s not the point at all.
Jim: But the point of it is, is this life has and magnifies our shortcomings.
Scarlet: Mmm hmm.
Jim: But God can use that, like he did in David’s life…
Jim: …King David…
Scarlet: Oh yeah.
Jim: …To be more than what he was in that moment. And that’s what I see in you guys, that the Lord has used this and used it in your life so you can actually be closer to Him…
Scarlet: Yes, absolutely.
Jim: …Bolder for Him, a warrior, spiritually speaking, for Him.
Scarlet: Yes, absolutely.
Jim: Does that resonate?
Scarlet: Yes. We’re a stronger family because…
Jim: Oh, the Pepin family…
Lindsay: Yes, we’re back.
Jim: …Is actually stronger now?
Scarlet: We are stronger. We’re more real and have a testimony and an absolutely beautiful granddaughter.
Jim: Well, we’re gonna come back and talk about that and the solutions that you struggled through next time. Can you stick with us?
Jim: Let’s do it.
Jim: This has been so good, you guys.
Jim: I’m hoping you, the listener, you’re resonating. This is one of those moments where, again, you know, so many families struggle. It may not be a pregnant daughter. We didn’t really talk much about the young man in this picture. And, uh, I’ve got two boys, and I’m trying to train them to be respectful to women, to not open their wedding present early.
Jim: Meaning that intimacy with your wife and all those things – I’m trying to check those boxes, too, Lindsay…
Jim: …And trying to do a good job. But I want to be there for them if something goes wrong.
Scarlet: Mmm. Yes.
Jim: And I think that’s every parent’s heart and desire. If you’re in that spot, get a hold of us. We’re here for you. Uh, we will help you with resources, with counselling. As John mentioned. And, uh, man, that’s the core thing. We are your extended family here.
Jim: And we want to help you. So, get in touch with us.
John: Yeah, we’re a phone call away. There’s no shame in the call. In fact, uh, take the courageous step to reach out and to share your story when you call 800, the letter A and the word FAMILY. 800-232-6459. Or online we have resources and help at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.
Jim: Uh, John, I so believe in this story because it captures so much of the trials and tribulations of parenting and being that teenager – uh, that I want every listener who needs the book to have the book. So, if you can’t afford to, uh, you know, provide a gift to Focus on the Family, just write us or call us. We will send it to you for free ’cause we want you to have this content. If you can help us, uh, financially, uh, for a gift of any amount, we’ll send you a copy of the book as our way of saying thank you. The greatest help is to become a monthly supporter of Focus so we can, um, help not only parents, but teenage girls and teenage boys and everybody (laughter), you know, that’s facing some difficulty. Uh, we’ll send you a copy of Joy Will Come, um, as our way of saying thank you.
John: Mmm hmm, yeah. The book really wonderfully captures God’s father heart and, uh, His grace. And so, do get in touch, make a donation if you can, and, uh, we’ll send a copy of Joy Will Come to you just as soon as we can. Again, our number is 800, the letter A and the word FAMILY. Well, on behalf of Jim Daly and the entire team, thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family. I’m John Fuller, inviting you back as we continue the conversation next time and once again help you and your family thrive in Christ.