Dr. Randy Schroeder: A successful person is no different than anyone else, except they have an extra amount of determination. And so kids are gonna face challenges. They may get a low test score, they may strike out in Little League, but parents need to believe in their child and reframe that adversity and say, “Well, this is just a new beginning.”
John Fuller: Great insight from Dr. Randy Schroeder, our guest today on Focus on the Family with Jim Daly as he talks about how to integrate some great habits into your parenting. Thanks for joining us. I’m John Fuller.
Jim Daly: John, isn’t it true that in the parenting journey, there’s those picture perfect moments when things are going well and you’re patting yourself on the back and your spouse on the back saying, “We are so good at this.”
John: (laughs).
Jim: And then there’s all the other moments where, you know it’s reality and you’re saying, “What am I doing? Am I doing harm? Why did I say that?” (laughs). And, uh, you know, it’s just so, uh, much the parenting story. And today we’re gonna talk with our guest about those core things that you need to do as a parent, uh, to really help that child grow up healthy. And I think, you know, when you look at it for Jean and I, it’s, are we being too passive or are we being too strict? All those kinds of questions. And today we’re gonna answer those with our guest.
John: I’m looking forward to the conversation. Dr. Randy Schroeder is a marriage and family counselor, a pastor, and a former seminary professor of pastoral counseling. Uh, he and his wife, Ginny, have been married for 47 years. They have two married sons, six grandchildren. And, um, Randy has a great passion, and you’ll hear more about that as we explore one of his great books is called Simple Habits for Effective Parenting: Specific Skills and Tools That Achieve Extraordinary Results in Raising a Child. And stop by focusonthefamily.com/broadcast for your copy of the book, or call 800-232-6459.
Jim: Randy, welcome back to Focus.
Dr. Schroeder: Well, thank you for having me back. I appreciate you and Focus on the Family helping marriages, parents and families thrive in Christ. That’s great.
Jim: You’ve read it.
Dr. Schroeder: Yeah, I’ve read that.
John: That’s our mission statement.
Dr. Schroeder: It’s the mission statement.
Jim: We do try to do that every day. Yeah, that’s great. Thank you for the, uh, homework you’ve done. (laughs)
Dr. Schroeder: You, you’re very welcome.
Jim: Hey, uh, on that kind of, uh, opening that we talked about there, uh, somebody once said to me, you know, “Parenting is so hard. God had two children, Adam and Eve, and they did, they kind of took the wrong steps.” I mean, that’s kind of fascinating to think about, right?
Dr. Schroeder: Well, it, parenting can be a challenge, and yet I think if we have, uh, the right skills and the right words and actions and knowledge, uh, parenting can be, uh, less stressful. And parents can effectively lead and guide their kids, uh, to being confident, capable, responsible, godly decision makers.
Jim: You know, Randy, one of the things that we hear here at Focus is the parents apply the formula, you know, do these things, and then we hear where it didn’t turn out so well. I think that’s in the minority of circumstances, but speak right at the front here, let’s talk these ideas, which I think, you know, our listeners, our viewers have really responded to your content. It’s straightforward. I love the relational aspect of what you talk about, maintain that relationship. We’re gonna get into all of that. But right at the forefront here, that idea that if I do A, B, and C, then I get D. It doesn’t always work that way, does it?
Dr. Schroeder: That is so correct because, uh, we can’t control outcomes. All we can do is influence our kids’ hearts. Parents can influence a heart to help a youngster, uh, learn obedience and learn good decision-making skills. And then hopefully that will translate into good decision-making when they’re, uh, throughout their, uh, formative years with their parents. And even more importantly, from the ages of 18 to 100, as adults, they’ll be good decision-makers. But you’re right, we cannot control the outcome.
Jim: And, and on the opposite side of that, it doesn’t give parents a free pass to be lazy in their parenting, I mean, you wanna lay the foundation so that they have the most predictive outcome. And, and that’s the key. There’s no guarantee. But if you do these things consistently, it’s more likely that your child will have a healthy spiritual life, uh, and life in general, right?
Dr. Schroeder: Yes sir, Jim, that is so true. And often parents just don’t have the knowledge. I, uh, desire to be a parent, uh, is great, motivation is great, but what really makes the difference is knowing how to build a strong parent-child relationship, knowing how to lovingly, meaningfully, uh, apply the rules so that a parent can ask, “Is this discipline decision gonna help my child be a better decision-maker,” uh, knowing how to help kids overcome, uh, chemicals and avoid the temptations in the world. And so Simple Habits for Effective Parenting gets the specifics. It’s not concepts in principles, and sadly, that’s what parents are often, uh, coming across, and they’re not coming across specifics that can make a huge difference in the life of their child.
Jim: Excellent. And we’re gonna start talking about the foundation building. And, uh, you do such a good job in helping parents better understand that. Of course, you’ve worked with parents and their children for years as a counselor. So you bring all that experience into the discussion. Um, setting that good foundation, speak to the three qualities that you have seen are most important to strengthen your child’s development.
Dr. Schroeder: It’s important, I think, uh, for a parent to think about their child at the age of 25, 35, 45, whatever, what qualities does a parent hope their child possesses at those adult ages and, and throughout their adult life? And certainly we could say the fruit of the Spirit; love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, self-control. Those are all very, very important. But what I truly think makes a difference, uh, in the life of the child, are three essential qualities, uh, especially in today’s society. And I’m gonna talk a little about each. The first is morals based on the Bible, secondly, would be building a strong internal character within a child, and then a third is determination. And so morals based on the Bible is where it begins. Uh, in today’s society, people make decisions on feelings. You know, if it feels good, I’m gonna do it, even though it may go against God’s Word and biblical values, uh, and what God wants for us. And so parents want their children to go into adult life with the absolutes of what is right, what is wrong. Uh, the 10 Commandments, sadly, in 1980, the 10 Commandments were taken outta public schools by-
Jim: In 1980.
Dr. Schroeder: 1980. Yeah. The Supreme Court-
Jim: It wasn’t that long ago, is my point.
Dr. Schroeder: Yeah. Yeah. And so, uh, but parents need to not take, uh, that for granted, and especially in today’s society, strengthen a child’s faith in Christ and strengthen morals based on the Bible.
Jim: Let me interject there, and then we’ll go to the next two. But, you know, in the culture, if, uh, the listeners and the viewers kids are going to public school, and even in some Christian schools, they’re gonna get pushback amongst their peers. If they say, “Well, I don’t believe in this, because the Bible says that,” how do we strengthen them in that particular area to be committed to those compass principles that are eternal, that we believe as Christians, that God gave us that are immovable? You’re not, it is like gravity. This is just the way it is.
Dr. Schroeder: That’s a tough question to answer.
Jim: Yeah.
Dr. Schroeder: And, and I think kids just have to come back, and parents too, that we believe firmly in God’s Word and God’s Word is the Bible. And therefore, we’re going to live by the biblical standards of the Bible. And we’re not gonna, uh, uh, people today want to say, uh, “Here’s my feelings. God, you conform to my feelings.” And I think-
Jim: That is so true.
Dr. Schroeder: Parents need to say, uh, “No. God has set the standard and we’re gonna conform to God’s Word and that standard,” and that’s what parents, uh, need to convey to their kids.
Jim: I’m telling you right now with my boys just tipping into their early 20s, those are great discussions with your teenagers.
Dr. Schroeder: Oh, sure.
Jim: I mean, crack that discussion open because they’re capable of talking to you about that dynamic.
Dr. Schroeder: Yeah. Yeah.
Jim: And the fact that we believe this, and therefore we act like this, and it’s just, it, just go head into it. Don’t, don’t, uh, shrink back would be my encouragement.
Dr. Schroeder: Totally agree.
Jim: Even as a 13, 14, 15-year-old. Um, let’s move to the second one, character. I love that one.
Dr. Schroeder: Well, and, and kids need a strong internal character. And that’s, uh, goes back to the morals based on the Bible. That’s strengthening, uh, their belief in those values. Kind of figure your earlier question, Jim. So that, uh, character is the external actions of what a person believes on the inside. Uh, and people with character make responsible godly decisions. And so parents need to work hard to talk about values at meal times, as you just said, you know, discussing with your sons, uh, and, and make sure that that character is strong, so that their external actions with kids at school and in society, uh, are in alignment with God’s Word.
Jim: That is so, so good. Character too, I mean, when you look at the bedrock of character, what do you think that is? I mean, what, what is the core thing in developing character? Obviously introducing them to the truth of God’s Word. I get that.
Dr. Schroeder: Mm-hmm.
Jim: But is, what’s that element in the human experience that provides the best garden to grow character?
Dr. Schroeder: I, I think it comes back, uh, to parents and, and what, uh, example is not the best teacher, example’s, the only teacher. And so as-
Jim: Parents have to live it.
Dr. Schroeder: Parents have to live that character. And more things are caught than taught. So a parent can talk about character, but it’s gonna be their example. It’s gonna be kids catching, uh, a parent’s character and integrity and seeing that parents are doing what’s right in God’s eyes, they’re not doing what’s right in the world’s eyes. And, and so then kids will absorb that.
Jim: That’s really good. And again, it, it’s not that complicated. I mean, it may be hard to do, but it’s not complicated.
Dr. Schroeder: No, parents, just, parents need to recognize kids are emotional sponges and they breathe in the family air, and so they’re gonna breathe in a parent’s character.
Jim: That’s really good. Okay, third is determination.
Dr. Schroeder: That that one is significant. Everyone in life has setbacks, adversity, it just happens. Uh, my synonym for determination is positive attitude. Someone with a positive attitude is determined. Someone who’s determined has a positive attitude. I don’t know you two men, Jim and John personally, and yet I can guarantee you, the two of you myself, we have been knocked down. We’ve had setbacks in our lives. We’ve had many unfair things happen in our lives. And yet we need to be men of bounce and bounce back up and, and stay determined. Uh, a successful person is no different than anyone else except they have an extra amount of determination.
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Schroeder: And so kids are gonna face challenges. They may get a low test score, they may strike out in Little League, uh, whatever it is, kids are gonna have adversity just as the three of us had adversity in every person in life. But parents need to believe in their child and reframe that adversity and say, “Well, this is just a new beginning. We’re gonna have a fresh start here. Next time you’re gonna do better on that quiz. And, and, and this is an opportunity to, uh, to work hard and to succeed and have that persistent effort.” And parents then can also say, uh, you know, “I believe in you. I’ve got confidence in you that you’re gonna stay determined. You’re not gonna give up.” Uh, that is just so essential.
Jim: And those are three, again, good basic foundational truths about building into your child that morals based on the Bible, character, determination. Moving forward, you speak to mutual respect and the importance of that as a parent with your relationship with your child. Um, some might say, and I would imagine as a counselor, you see this pretty consistently. This might be probably the biggest, would be my assumption, the biggest reason there’s disruption in the parent-child relationship, the lack of mutual respect and dialogue. And, and kids jump on that, respond to it out of their emotional tank. And parents do too. And I’m guilty of it. I mean, there were times, and our oldest was a very strong-willed child.
Dr. Schroeder: Mm-hmm.
Jim: (laughs) And so he was able to lasso me often and get me down into that argument, you know, where I had to shake it off, go, “What am I doing, arguing with my nine-year-old?” But speak to that mutual respect and the importance of it.
Dr. Schroeder: Well, I think, and, and you and Jim, there are no perfect parents, of course. And there’s no perfect kid.
Jim: Thanks for repeating that. That’s important. (laughs)
Dr. Schroeder: Always, always keep that in mind.
Jim: Say it again.
Dr. Schroeder: Yeah. And, and what does Matthew 7 say, “Treat others as you wanna be treated.” And, and yet, I think-
Jim: Does that include your kids? (laughs)
Dr. Schroeder: I think a lot, yeah, you’re right. Yeah. I think a lot of that’s the attitude. A lot of times parents can think, “Well, my children need to respect me, but I don’t really always have to respect them.” And that’s not true. And, and a child treated with disrespect, often misbehaves.
Jim: Yeah. Think of that.
Dr. Schroeder: It’s just, it’s, it’s just interesting that parents that are disrespecting their kids, uh, being sarcastic, putting them down, uh, not listening well, uh, breaking their promises. Uh, when respect is not there, then kids misbehave. And yet mutual respect, like you said, Jim, is critical for kids to trust their parents. When a child has respect for their parent, they trust that their parent has their best interest at heart. And that, and then that causes a child to listen, that, “Hey, my dad and mom have my best interest at heart. I respect them.”
Jim: That is so good. There’s a news commentator opinion guy who said this, uh, one time, and I caught it ’cause I thought it was so profound, he said, you know, “It’s come down to where half the country love their dads, the other half hate their dads.” Isn’t that an amazing insight? Because what you’re describing is if that kind of relationship does not exist in childhood when they’re young adults, they’re typically bringing into that experience a lot of baggage-
Dr. Schroeder: Yes, sir. That’s so true
Jim: … of, you know, lack of respect for authority. Uh, you know, just all those things that can work against a person having a healthy attitude about life.
Dr. Schroeder: Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, that is true. And a child’s picture of our Heavenly Father is their picture of their dad often. And so, uh, and it begins again with mutual respect.
John: Mm. Well, this is Focus on the Family with Jim Daly, and today our guest is Dr. Randy Schroeder. Uh, we’re talking about some basic parenting stuff that, uh, all of us need to either know or be refreshed about. And, uh, there is so much here in his book, Simple Habits for Effective Parenting. Get your copy from us here, uh, call 800-232-6459, or stop by focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.
Jim: Randy, you mentioned, um, avoiding parenting extremes. And I think it’s really important to cover this because, uh, this too is so core to our experiences as parents. You say that you don’t want to be that controlling or overprotective or permissive parent. So hit those three quickly.
Dr. Schroeder: Well, the, the, uh, and let me just start out by saying, the Bible says, “Children obey your parents and everything for this pleases the Lord.” So Christian parents wanna seek obedience because that leads to good decision making. And yet loving Christian parents can fall into these extremes, uh, of controlling, wanting to control every aspect of a child’s life. And controlling parents often are loving, but they’re focused on short-term behavior.
Jim: Can I, let me interject. I, I’m hearing mom go, “But Randy, do you know the culture they’re in? I have to control things because I need to protect them.”
Dr. Schroeder: And, and that’s, that’s the second extreme being overprotective. But yeah, no par- parents think that that’s the case. And, uh, and the thing is, when parents control their children, those kids often do not become good decision makers-
Jim: Because they don’t grow up.
Dr. Schroeder: Yes, sir. You’re right. They don’t grow up. They don’t, uh, increase their self-confidence. They don’t believe they’re capable. They think, you know, “I’m, I’m kind of incompetent.” And so it’s extremely important for parents to seek obedience and good decision making, not try to control every aspect of a child’s life.
Jim: Can I ask you this? Just so parents have a sense of self-awareness ’cause I, I’m not sure that we do, and Jean and I sometimes we’re over-controlling. It’s, you know, you’re bouncing along a, a perfect line and you’re not always on that line. So you’ve gotta be able to have some self-reflective ability to say, “Okay, that I was not in the right spot at that moment.” For that parent that may not see that they’re controlling, what would be that environment? What would it look like where you have to take the self-assessment to say, “Okay, I’m, I’m not in a healthy place with this.”
Dr. Schroeder: Well, I, I think they’re probably doing too much talking, and we may talk a little about that later-
Jim: Yeah, we will.
Dr. Schroeder: … and too much directing of the child. And I, I think, uh, parents need to be like Jesus, Jesus asked 307 questions in the Bible, Socrates, the Socratic method is asking questions. I, and so I think rather than parents wanting to control and just direct this and direct that, they need to let their child speak out loud what they are thinking. And then if it’s not healthy, then parents can kinda redirect them.
Jim: Alright. Then overprotective, just a quick description.
Dr. Schroeder: Overprotective is just thinking that a, a parent needs to protect a child from the physical bumps and bruises in life, and even the emotional bumps and bruises in life. And they rush in right away, when a youngster falls down and overprotective parent rushes in right away to take care of that child. And, and they need to let the child handle that bump and bruise on their own, that strengthens them.
John: You know, Randy, along those lines, the whole culture is fear-based about what could happen. So how do we fight that? How do we, how do we assume that our kids actually can get bumps and scrapes and difficulties, uh, can happen to them and they’ll be okay?
Dr. Schroeder: I, I think just recognizing that that’s a normal part of life. But a lot of times parents, again, it’s because they’re so loving. Christian parents are loving and they want the best for their kids. And yet that is not going back to what we said earlier, building a strong internal character. It’s not helping a child, uh, stay determined. Uh, and, and the, uh, you think about a baby, a baby falls or stumbles, falls, and rises back up, a baby stumbles, falls, rises back up and, and eventually that baby learns to walk. Likewise, even in preschool, elementary, high school, kids need to learn to rise back up and be individuals of balance. And with God’s help, they can do that.
Jim: Yeah. It’s so, so good. You also have the amazing A’s, I want to cover this basic stuff then the rest of today and next time, uh, we’re gonna get into more depth here.
Dr. Schroeder: Okay.
Jim: What are the amazing A’s?
Dr. Schroeder: Well, the, the first one is acceptance. Kids need unconditional love. And that’s what acceptance is. Uh, God says to every Christian person, “I love you and I will always love you, and sometimes I don’t or I don’t approve of your sinful thoughts, words, and actions.” And likewise, a parent needs to use, I say, run on sentences, and use that word and, and say, “I love you and I’ll always love you, and I don’t approve of your missteps or your mistakes.” So that a kid, a youngster, knows that mom and dad love me. They want have my best interest at heart. They want me to become confident, a good decision maker. Uh, and then another A, uh, is attention. Kids need attention from mom and dad, and that’s just not being in the home. So many dads especially, but could be moms, think if I’m in physical proximity with my child, I’m giving them attention.
Jim: Check that box.
Dr. Schroeder: Check that box. No, it has to be, the eyes are windows to the heart. It needs to be looking into a child’s eyes, uh, having dialogue, encouraging a child. Uh, another A that’s so very important is appreciation, uh, and, and telling a child, we may talk a little more about that later, but, uh, what they appreciate, uh, about the child, “Thank you,” I define as gratitude. Good to tell a child, “Thank you for doing this. Thank you for saying that.” It’s even more important to say, “I appreciate.” And then affection. Affection is absolutely huge and parents need to think of affection as verbal and physical affection.
Jim: Mm-hmm.
Dr. Schroeder: That is what makes a huge difference. It’s not, 70% of adults I’ve counseled, uh, have told me that they did not receive both verbal and physical love from their parents growing up.
Jim: Yeah. I, you know, that idea of that, uh, physical expression is so critical.
Dr. Schroeder: Oh, it’s huge.
Jim: And I really want to hit that because I think sometimes parents pull back, especially as the children get older.
Dr. Schroeder: Yes, sir.
Jim: And my, my oldest, he just, he didn’t know how to hug. He was like a piece of cardboard. And I, I actually did teach him how to hug.
Dr. Schroeder: Good, good for you. That’s terrific. That’s terrific.
Jim: And he’s a great hugger today.
Dr. Schroeder: That’s terrific.
Jim: But, um, but describe, I think he had a conversation with a father whose son was shoplifting or something like that.
Dr. Schroeder: Yes, sir.
Jim: And how did that expression of affection change his attitude? The son’s?
Dr. Schroeder: It, it was absolutely an amazing story. Uh, it was sadly a divorce. And the mom had custody of the two boys. And the 13-year-old had an older brother, both the boys were getting in trouble with the law. They were having behavioral issues at school. They weren’t getting good grades, they were struggling there. They did not have healthy friendships. And the older son actually then started doing cocaine. And the mom said, you know, “I’m not doing the job. I’m gonna give the 13-year-old to our son’s dad and see if he can turn him around.” Well, the 13-year-old came to live with dad the last Friday of May. Sunday, the 13-year-old stole a bicycle in the neighborhood, two days later.
Jim: So he was on that bad track as well.
Dr. Schroeder: He, he, he wasn’t off the bad track yet. Well, the dad immediately called me and I met with the dad and the son. And I actually, going back to that appreciation, I had the dad give the son a big compliment to start the session to say, “I appreciate this about you.” And then, I met with dad privately and I asked dad to go for a walk every single day throughout this summer when his son was not in school. And mentally keep track, touch your son 12 times every time you go around the block, lovingly squeeze his arm, pat him on the back, tussle his hair, give him a half hug when you’re walking, and also give him an appreciation vitamin. By the end of the summer, that young man had become a responsible decision-maker. Now, did he still make mistakes?
Jim: Yeah, sure. But, but explain from a counselor’s perspective, what, what changed in the young man’s heart?
Dr. Schroeder: Well, and I don’t want parents to think that, “Oh my goodness, Dr. Schroeder just said, all I have to do is give a lot of touch to my youngster and they’re gonna be good decision-makers.” It’s more than touch, but touch, what’s the old cliche is worth a thousand words.
Jim: Well it opens the window of the heart.
Dr. Schroeder: It does. And we think about Jesus in the Bible, 22 times when Jesus healed people, He touched them to show us the importance of touch. Now, could Jesus have healed them without touch? Well, certainly He’s God, but Jesus touched them. And so I think that touch emotionally bonds a parent and child together. And, and, and I tell you, I saw the dad and the other thing, I went over the simple, yet very effective habits, this knowledge, not concepts and principles in, in Simple Habits for Effective Parenting book, and I went over that with this dad and he started applying that with his son, learning how to lovingly set limits and apply discipline and lovingly how to build a strong parent-child relationship and everything else. And it just turned that young man’s life around.
Jim: Mm-hmm. Now it is so good. And again, we’re laying foundations that are predictive outcomes, but not guaranteed outcomes.
Dr. Schroeder: Exactly. Exactly.
Jim: Just to repeat what we said at the beginning.
Dr. Schroeder: Yes sir.
Jim: Randy, this has been so good and we got more to cover. So let’s come back next time and dig a little deeper into this whole area. But I know parents are gonna be profoundly helped in this way, and this is all Bible-based material. I mean, you’re not making this up outta thin air. These are things that you’ve put together as a counselor, trained in that area and the biblical perspective on how to apply those great truths that the Lord has given us. And I love it even with, uh, you know, kids in their 20s right now thinking back, “Yeah, we did that pretty well. We could have done that better.” But one thing that Jean and I always say to each other is, “I just wish we had more information back when.” And so for the back when parents, when you have kids that are 5, 6, 7 years old, man, is this material ripe for you. And if you’re the grandparent listening or watching today, get this resource for your adult kids and talk to ’em about it. Send them a copy of the broadcast as well. But, uh, thank you, Randy, for being with us.
Dr. Schroeder: Well, thank you very much for having me. And I want your listeners to know as well, my wife and I made mistakes.
Jim: Really?
Dr. Schroeder: We did not, we did not do it. Use that dirty word perfectly.
Jim: Yeah.
Dr. Schroeder: All parents make mistakes. All-
Jim: So true.
Dr. Schroeder: … healthy Christian parents have regrets. And yet when we have the knowledge specifics, not concepts and principles, it can make a huge difference.
Jim: Well, you know, one, one way to kick that journey off is, uh, a parenting assessment that we have here at Focus on the Family called 7 Traits of Effective Parenting. It takes a few minutes, five to six, seven minutes to take it. It’ll point out some areas that you’re doing really well in and then some areas to improve in. And I’m sure, uh, Randy’s great book is one of the wonderful resources that we, uh, advise parents to, uh, listen to or to read. And you can get a copy of Randy’s book and we’ll make it simple. We always do this. If you can help Focus, uh, do ministry, be part of it, uh, that reward in Heaven is there for you, when we work together to do ministry for those who need it, uh, make a gift of any amount, it helps substantially. If you could do that on a monthly basis, not a big amount, but that little bit over the consistency of 12 months really helps us in the budget or a one-time gift. We’ll send you a copy of Randy’s book, Simple Habits for Effective Parenting as our way of saying thank you for being part of the ministry.
John: Yeah. Donate as you can contribute to the work of Focus on the Family. And when you do, request Randy’s great book, Simple Habits for Effective Parenting, our number is 800, the letter A, and the word FAMILY, or donate and request the book and other resources at focusonthefamily.com/broadcast. And as you’re making your summer vacation plans, be sure to include us here at Focus on the Family. We have a beautiful campus here in Colorado Springs, nestled at the foot of America’s mountain, Pikes Peak. And, uh, there are so many great things to do here at our welcome center and bookstore. We hope you’ll stop in and see all the great things happening here at the ministry. Thanks for joining us for Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I’m John Fuller inviting you back tomorrow as we continue the conversation with Dr. Randy Schroeder and once again, help you and your family thrive in Christ.
