Kari Kampakis: It really matters that we keep a pulse on their lives that there’s a lot at stake if our teenagers are struggling and we don’t have that relationship in place to be able to sense that something’s wrong and they might be acting out. It might come out as anger or something else, but really trying to build that bridge to them, so that they know they can come to us and that we can show them God’s love and help them get through the struggles they’re going through.
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John Fuller: That’s Kari Kampakis, and she’s with us today on Focus on the Family. Your host is Focus president and author Jim Daly. And I’m John Fuller.
Jim Daly: I wanna speak to the moms because you have a powerful influence, uh, for your children’s lives. I see it through my wife Jean, with our boys. And it’s amazing how much influence Jean has with our kids. In any relationship, it takes intentionality and care, (laughs) in marriage, in parenting, uh, the relationships all around you. Here at Focus on the Family, we wanna remind you that God has equipped you to be your daughter’s mother, and we’re gonna concentrate on that theme today with our guest. I think it’s a wonderful way to see your role as mom and what you’re there to do. And we’re gonna unpack all of that. And we want to help you be the best mom you can be, and we know your heart is there. I talk some dads. “Yeah, I wanna to do okay.”
Jim: Moms never say that. Moms are like, “I wanna be perfect.”
Jim: And we’re gonna discuss how to be better today.
John: Hmm. Yeah. And Kari Kampakis is with us. She’s a blogger and a speaker from Birmingham, Alabama, and she and her husband Harry have four girls, Ella, Sophie, Marie-Claire, and Camille and she’s written a number of books. One we’re gonna look at today ties right into what you were talking about Jim, it’s called Love Her Well: 10 Ways to Find Joy and Connection with Your Teenage Daughter. And of course, we have copies of that here. Call 800-A-FAMILY or stop by focusonthefamily.com/broadcast.
Jim: Kari, welcome to Focus on the Family.
Kari: Thanks for having me.
Jim: I’m actually excited to talk to you about this, cause it, it’s out of my space. I have two boys; I am not raising girls. I have my wife Jean, who was a wonderful daughter. I actually asked her this today, cause I… You know, I said what kind of daughter were you? And she said, “Oh, I was a pretty good daughter.” But she reminded me of a story where she wrote Dear Abby, when she was like 14 or 15, complaining that her mom would not let her date until she was 16. And how upset she was about that, cause she’s such a good daughter, “She could trust me to date early, I’m not gonna to mess up.” And she said it was so hormonal. (Laughs). And I said, “Well man, is that the normal thing. So, let’s just start there. I mean, with that teen daughter, is there just a lot of hormones going on? (Laughs).
Kari: There is. I just think with any teenagers, and especially when it’s your first child that you don’t, you don’t really see it coming because you don’t know. I can say now with my fourth child getting there, I know a little bit what to expect. But with our first one, and I think you’re also coming out of that sweet spot of parenting, they’re, they’re out of diapers or sleeping through the night. They’re easy, they’re pretty capable of taking care of themselves, um, you know, that 9- to 11-year-old range, and then all of a sudden, they are being thrown into puberty and hormones, a lot of social shakeups, we now have social media they’re dealing with, and their brains are not fully developed, as we all know. And so, it really, it can be hard because they might do something like your, your wife did, that’s pretty out of character. And as moms, you know, when you hear about that, it’s hard not to feel that rejection or take it personally. And it really is important to know that this is normal for that stage of life that they’re learning and growing just as we’re learning and growing, but how to, you know, balance loving them through the teenage years with also parenting them through the teenage years.
Jim: Right. And it’s so easy to go that direction, talk about all the difficulties. Right?
Jim: Dealing with this. All of a sudden, my daughter was crying, I didn’t know why. When you look back raising four daughters, you’re still in that. I mean, you’re still active raising these wonderful girls.
Jim: Um, what’s been one of the high points for you? Let’s, let’s really start there. What’s been something you look back on and go, “Wow, that, that was really good.”
Kari: You know, I think the high point of teenagers is just getting to know them as people and realizing that they’re not a child anymore, that I’m seeing their adult personality, and being able to have some deep conversations and just the laughter. And you know, there are moments I’ve even been with all my daughters in the car, and they all have different personalities. And I felt like this feels like a road trip I used to take with my college girlfriends where everybody has a different personality, and they’re chiming in, and they all have their own quirks and idiosyncrasies. But just the group dynamic is so fun.
Kari: And that’s the fun part to me, is that it’s so different than when, when they were little. And I think that’s what we’re trying to capture as parents, are those high points and those joys and those moments we feel connected, and we feel like we’re building these strong family bonds that we really want.
Jim: And I’m gonna over this time we’re gonna unfold that together. And I’m looking forward to that, cause I know where this is going.
Jim: The listeners have to hang tight because that’s the goal. I mean, you want to be not only your adult child’s, uh, parent, but you need to transition to being their friend. And that, that is a good thing.
Jim: It’s not a bad thing when your grown child says, “Hey, it’s, it’s great being your friend.”
Jim: That’s wonderful.
Jim: I just had that experience with Trent. He said the other night, it was such a touching thing. He was, “Dad, I just, I just love the fact that we’re friends-
Jim: … and we have a lifetime of friendship together now.” I was like, “Wow!” But, um, while, uh, raising kids can be difficult, we touch on that, uh, there are those challenges. I love the story, the bare-knuckle story of your husband coming home and finding you sobbing in a closet.
Jim: (Laughs). Now everybody’s going, “What!” What happened? And what did that teach you?
Kari: Yes. This was my oldest daughter’s 19. So, this was when she was 13. And keep in mind that since she was a baby, I’ve been hearing that script, “Your baby is so beautiful, but just wait until she’s a teenager, you’re in for it.” And when you have four daughters, you hear that over and over just that narrative, that negative narrative in the world.
Kari: And I didn’t really buy into it. And that was thinking my girls won’t be that way. But what happened was, as she started to become a teenager, and the normal things started to happen, and our relationship started to change, I started to blame it on her. I’m like, “Oh, those moms were right.” And my response was, I got to share these girls who’s boss, I’ve got to dig in my heels. And I just was like, you know, she… This her attitude is gotta go, her sass has got to go. And I wasn’t looking at myself. What happened was it just created this gulf between us. And I don’t even remember what we’re fighting over. That’s how silly the arguments were. But it had been a couple of months, and I hadn’t even shared it with my husband because I kept thinking this will pass, she’ll, she’ll start listening to me again-
Kari: … we’ll get, we’ll get that close relationship back, you know, naïve new mom. And, um, and things were just getting worse. And we had a fight one day before school, and she went to school, and I was just, I, I was about to apologize and I’m like, “Nope, I’m not apologizing.” And then it was an hour later, my house was quiet, and I think that’s when God’s Spirit was really able to speak to me. And I just started having all this regret for our relationship. And I was, I realized, I was like, “This gulf between us is getting bigger.” And I just fell to my knees in my closet, just crying.
Kari: And the irony was, I was writing books for teenage girls at the time. Um, I’ve written two books for teenage girls. So, I was traveling all over speaking to these moms and these teenage girls, um, you know, being called an expert, which I didn’t feel like. And so, I remember being in my closet thinking nobody can ever know about this. (Laughing). This rock bottom parenting moment. But it was really the moment where I humbled myself, and I just let God open my eyes to the problem was really me and how I was responding to her. And I was making the problem worse.
Jim: Kari, let me get into that a little bit-
Jim: … on behalf of the many moms listening right now saying, “No, they are sassy, they are fussy, they are emotional-
Jim: … it is their fault.”
Jim: Their… How do you come to that realization that you can only control you? I mean, this is true of raising boys too.
Jim: You got to come to that parenting moment where you go, “Okay, I can’t control them.”
Jim: What do you think the Lord looks down upon us with? (Laughs).
Jim: “Man, I cannot control these creatures I made.”
Jim: I mean, it’s very similar. I think that’s the whole metaphor.
Jim: I think that’s what the Lord has done here for us.
Jim: Especially as parents as we look at these rascals and they’re not behaving the way we want them to behave. But the reality is, there is a lot of pain in that. And not everybody has that closet revelation, if I could call it that, where you come to a point where you’re saying, “Okay, I gotta work on me, because that’s all I can do.”
Jim: So, what advice do you have for that mom that’s still shouting at us right now saying, “You don’t know my daughter.”
Kari: Right. I think the first po- point to be able to do that, I call it the fearless self-inventory. You have to really feel secure and know God’s love for you. And I had to really to be able to look at myself and just admit, like, this is where I’m failing, that I’m reacting to her. And I realized that it was my pride, that it was my pride getting in the way because I wanted to look like a superstar mom. And you know, up until that point I kind of had, she was a pretty compliant child. And so suddenly, our relationship was changing. And I, I just blamed it on her, but I wasn’t looking at, um, when she got sassy, I was sassy back.
Kari: I was just mirroring her reaction. And I could look back and say, “I, I’m acting like a 16-year-old.” You know? I’m not acting like the adult in this situation.
Jim: No, it’s so true.
Kari: (Laughs). It’s so true. And, and I think I was taking some of those things we do when they’re little, you know, when they’re little we are pretty blunt, don’t run in the street, don’t do this, you know. And we take those same parenting strategies into the teenage years, and it doesn’t always translate because-
Jim: It doesn’t always, or never translates.
Kari: (Laughs). Never translates. Never translates.
Kari: So, we can’t. We need to parent in a new way and we… Sometimes we are to go in the back door or wait to find ways to speak the truth in love. And what really helped me, um, during that time that I was struggling, I was like, “This is my… I gotta search how do I parent her, but also love her and not lose this relationship at the very time that I wanted the most in the teenage years?”
Jim: Yeah, without a doubt. In fact, one of the strategies you talked about in Love Her Well, is this idea of well-timed communication.
Jim: Now, you know, when I was reading that, I was thinking, “Okay, this, this takes effort.” So, I think that one level speaks to the fact that you have to be intentional-
Jim: … about these moments, you have to be aware of them. It, it does take intuitiveness to say, “Okay, I got to think about this.”
Jim: And then talk about the timely communication. What does that look like?
Kari: Yes, it’s funny with each book I write, there’s always a chapter or a story that readers relate to the most. And that first chapter is choose your words and your timing carefully. And that’s the number one chapter in story, the opening story that readers relate to. And they say, “I saw myself in that situation.” And basically, I think as moms, sometimes we have a thought, or we say something we need to correct, our child needs to work on. And if they’re like me, if I’m like, if I don’t say it now, I’ll forget. And you know, you feel this pressure to get it right, because they’ll be leaving home in a few years. So, you want to try to help shape them the way you want to. But sometimes it’s not the best timing to say something or the best way to say something.
Jim: So, then you talk to your husband. (Laughing). I know how this works. But no, I’m serious. I mean, that’s part of the issue too, huh? You decide to talk to your husband about it. And he’s going, “Uh, why don’t you talk to our daughter? (Laughs).
Kari: Right. Exactly. I’m like, “I need you to help me here.”
Kari: But but the story I used in the, in the book was, um, I had a daughter, she was having a breakout on her face. But we were in the car having this great conversation, just the kind of conversations you want to have with your teenager playing the music. It was a beautiful day. And we parked the car, and I look over and all of a sudden, what stands out to me is the sunlights on her face, and her acne has flared up. And so, I’m starting to ask her like moms do, are you using your acne medication? And I stopped myself and I know it was God stopping me because I had done the same thing a few months earlier. And I know my daughter, she’s very responsible, she wanted this acne to be gone more than anybody else. It was a sensitive subject. We’d been trying all these creams for several months. And, um, and when I’d asked her a few months earlier, if she’d been using her medication, she said, “Yes, I know, my face looks terrible.” And I just saw her look-
Kari: … she… It just totally was a downer. And I thought to myself, “If I say this now, I know she’s using her creams, is just totally going to undo that moment we just had in the car. So, I’m going to keep my mouth shut and just wait.” And she got out of the car happy that memory was saved. And I was, I learned a lesson that like, I didn’t have to say that then, I could save that conversation for later and find the right time to do it.
Jim: I’m, I’m smiling cause-
Jim: … I just did that the other night with one of my sons. (Laughs). The Lord didn’t stop me. (Laughing). Or maybe he tried, and I didn’t hear him.
Jim: But it’s exactly the same thing. It was like, “Are you washing your face?”
Jim: You know, so a couple of times I have stopped, but now I will stop.
Kari: Right. (Laughs).
Jim: Thank you for that admonition.
John: Are you-
John: … thinking of anything? (Laughing).
Jim: But it’s so true as parents, you know, yeah, we’re jumping on things. You know, I know that, you know, think of that teen acne.
Jim: They’re not aware of it. (Laughing).
Kari: Exactly. And I found sometimes I know, I’m like this conversation needs to be had, but God give me the words. Like, what’s the way I can kind of, kind of gently, subtly slide in this conversation without them getting defensive? Because I know it’s a sensitive subject.
Jim: Yeah. Let me ask you this. Uh, and again, I don’t have the experience. So, help me understand it. But I’ve read, you know, a lot of data on this. When moms and daughters are fighting, whatever that may look like, there tends to be this reconciliation, they may be sobbing together, and then bang, they’re hugging. “Oh, I’m so sorry.” And that happens over some period of time.
Jim: With boys with moms, what I read often in some of the literature is, boys just take it as shame-
Jim: … if a mom is correcting them, and look me in the eye, and boys don’t wanna look you in the eye cause it’s shameful. I did something wrong, I disappointed you. And they kind of cocoon where it sounds like daughters, you can get through it. It’s just another spat.
Kari: Right. Yes.
Jim: Is, is that accurate on the daughter side?
Jim: Is that kind of how it works?
Kari: Yes. I think and something that’s really helped, I guess, inspire me and empower me, is just knowing the importance of conflict resolution. And really realizing we know we’ve all been parenting a long time that in any long-term relationship, whether it’s with your child or your marriage, you’re going to have some conflict. And if there’s not conflict, you might not be honest with each other. But you know, there’s all this research that says, is it John Gottman, who’s America’s-
Kari: … top couples’ therapist? He said, the number one predictor of success in marriage is how well two people can work through conflict.
Kari: And I took that into parenting my daughter, instead of being so scared every time we cut conflict, his teacher healthy ways to work through this, because I see this in my work with teen girls, these friendships that end because they get mad at each other, and they can’t resolve the conflict.
Kari: Or they can’t express how they were hurt. Or they express it in an unhealthy way. And it just ruins their relationships.
Kari: And I’m like, nobody’s really teaching them that. But this has consequences for their marriage, for their career, for every relationship in the future. So, I, I started thinking, you know, in my relationship with my daughter, this is unconditional love. Even if she gets it wrong, she’s not going to lose my love. And so, what better place to learn how to resolve conflict in a healthy way, than when we do fight. So, that kind of gives-
Kari: … some meaning to your arguments.
Jim: Yeah, I was gonna ask you and I should have a, a moment ago, which was how, how do you not let yourself be triggered to act like that 16-year-old-
Jim: … with your 16-year-old when you start this fight? Um-
Jim: … what do you think about when your emotions are tempted? How do you back up and say, “Okay, let me be the adult in the room.”? As you described it?
Kari: Right. Well, I think, you know, I think you’ve alluded to this too, sometimes we have to fail to get it right the next time. Get it wrong first, and this say, “Okay, next time, I’m going to respond differently. I know better, I’m going to do it differently.” So that’s helped me, is just admitting to my daughter, I messed up, I’m going to work on this. And then in the future, trying to do it differently. And if I don’t, if I fail, which I do, apologizing again. But just really trying to get it right. And I also think that, um, and I do think this is one way that moms fail themselves, is that we are not keeping ourselves in fighting condition, that sometimes we’re not in a strong place that that makes us really reactive to what our kids are doing. So, the older I get, the more I’m like, you know, my friendships and my relationships with my husband and other people who love me, that’s like a form of self-care. Because these are the people that build me up, that help me stay strong for when I do turn around and love my daughter and try to keep loving her even when she’s not acting very lovable.
Jim: Yeah, I mean, that’s a good point, when your bucket is empty-
Jim: … what are you gonna respond with?
Jim: Probably something very empty as well.
John: That’s some great insights today from Kari Kampakis on Focus on the Family. And we’re so glad to have her here talking about some of the content in her book, Love Her Well: 10 Ways to Find Joy and Connection with Your Teenage Daughter.” And you can find your copy of that book at our website, focusonthefamily.com/broadcast, or call 800 the letter A, and the word, FAMILY.
Jim: Kari, I probably should’ve asked this a while ago, but describe the world, especially for someone like Jean, and, and me with no daughters, what is the world like for a teen girl today?
Kari: Oh, (laughs). It just breaks my heart. And I think that is really, that is something that can help mothers soften toward their daughters, is what we’re saying on the outside that hardness or that edginess. Usually, they’re struggling on the inside. But you know, I see the number one email and phone call I get is just girl struggling with friendship. I think they live in an age of disposable friendships. And you know, for the teenage years, especially for girls, friends are like oxygen. So, when something goes wrong in that area of life, it is devastating. So, they’re having these friendship struggles, anxiety, you know, you talk to any counselor, you can’t even get and talk with the counselor now, because anxiety has become such an issue, um, especially since the quarantine, um, not only with teenage girls, but teenage boys too. Depression, um, the suicide rate for teenage girls I think is the highest it’s been in 40 years.
Kari: And so, that’s one thing I just wanna really encourage parents, is that it really matters that we keep a pulse on their lives, that there’s a lot at stake if our teenagers are struggling and we don’t have that relationship in place to be able to sense that something’s wrong and they might be acting out, it might-
Kari: … come out as anger or something else. But really trying to build that bridge to them so that they know they can come to us and that we can show them God’s love and help them get through these struggles they’re going through.
Jim: And that is so good. In preparing our kids for adulthood, you suggest a few things like talking about the five second decision. I really like that, describe the five second decision.
Kari: Yes. And, um, I learned that through experience. Sometimes we parents are put on the spot. You know, your child comes to you, and they’ve got three friends with them. They ask you, “Can I spend the night at someone’s house?” And you’ve got five seconds to make a decision. And you’re thinking I don’t know so and so, I don’t know the parents, I don’t know what kind of environment that might be. But also talking to our children and saying that you’re going to be in these situations where you have these five second decisions, and to really pre decide what you wanna do. So, it might be you’re at a party and somebody offers you a drink. You’ve got five seconds to make that decision. And it’s going to feel awkward, but how do you get through that awkwardness and try to do the right thing? Um, another example from a mother standpoint, I had a friend that she was at the lake with her daughter and a bunch of their friends. I think that they were 14-year-old girls, no, I guess the girls were older, they were 16 because the boys were driving the boat. But these two boys in their class pulled up and asked the girls that they wanted to go riding with them. And so, my friend was like my husband and I had to step away for a minute because one we don’t know what kind of drivers these boys are, we’re responsible for all these girls. And this mom knew that the boys had just been busted for drinking by their mother.
Kari: And so, she’s like, “We had that five second decision.” And they decided not to let the girls go, which is so hard.”
Jim: Oh, yeah.
Kari: Because you hate to be that parent. You know your child will be embarrassed and mad at you. But you know, I think as we learn to make those fast second decisions as parents and kind of stand strong, it helps model that for our children to do the same thing in their life too.
Jim: Sure, that’s good. And, and what a… Yeah, that works for daughters and sons.
Kari: Mm-hmm. Exactly.
Jim: That’s just a good rule of thumb in my opinion. Um, how do you pray for your daughters? I know how I pray for sons, (laughs), but what, what role does faith play in, in your home and how do you pray for them?
Kari: Oh, it’s huge. I, I pray for them all the time. Even when they were little, I probably did more praying over them when they were young, and I was tucking them into bed. Now I do a lot of prayers throughout the day. And I have one daughter that’s in college, so I’m praying for her just for her safety and protection and good people coming into her life. But, um, I just really pray… I’ve learned I can pray a five second prayer, if I’m worried about something, if there’s something that’s making me anxious, just sending that prayer up to God. But, um, but yeah, you know, I just realized I’ve got two kids with food allergies, one of them had an allergic reaction last week-
Kari: … and you know, with me coming out of town, I mean, you know, my husbands with me, that created a lot of anxiety in me the past few days. And so, I just have really had to lean into my prayer life and my faith. And God please protect them, especially if I’m not there, give them the tools that they might need.
Kari: So, I don’t really have a system, but I just, just continually through the day as they come to mind or as I’m having quiet time, I think of specific prayers that I think-
Kari: … might be helpful.
Jim: Let’s talk about the positive side you just mentioned. What are a few ways that you can enjoy-?
Jim: … your teen girl and the teen girl years?
Kari: Yes. Well, I’ve-
Jim: Everybody’s leaning in now.
Jim: Seriously, you can enjoy this?
Kari: Yes. They’re so fun. I mean, just their energy and excitement. And it doesn’t take much to make them happy. And that’s what’s so cool about a teenager, is that you don’t have to plan, some fancy trip. It’s just these little daily gestures that mean a lot. Um, I talked to a girl whose mother had passed away a few years ago-
Kari: … she was sharing her best memories with her mom, and she said she danced. And so many great memories were made as they were traveling to these dance competitions. But her mom would also do things like if she knows she had a hard week at school, or she had a big test day, that she’d have her favorite Greek salad waiting for at home. Just that little act of love. Like I know you, I see you-
Kari: … and I’m proud of you. She said one time she went on a trip with her friends and her mom, she opened her suitcase at the beach, and her mom had packed a new blouse in her suitcase and some snacks for the friends. So, I think it’s just those little things-
Kari: … like that, that you know, we see our daughters, we’re like, “You are smart, and kind and beautiful.” We see how amazing they are. But they don’t see that about themselves. They, they are surrounded by girls who are smart, and kind and beautiful. And so just being singled out like that. And then that, that they are so loved by their parents and showing God’s love that way.
Kari: Um, but then I think just knowing their heart too, if they love icies, or like I said Greek salads, or acai bowls, or queso. I think queso as always, a huge hit for teenagers. You know that all their friends are coming to your house after they’ve been out, have some snacks out-
Kari: … their favorite foods, just little things like that.
Jim: Right here then, you mentioned the book, some core beliefs about parenting. I think it’d be great for the listeners, the viewers to hear those. What are they?
Kari: Well, um, a few of them are, one, parenting is too big and challenging for parents to handle alone. And God didn’t create us to handle it alone. He is there to support us. And we also need community to go through it with us.
Jim: I like that,
Kari: Uh, another big one is that, you know, we know what God wants, he wants unity and harmony in our relationships, we have an enemy who wants to destroy our relationships. And a lot of times when we feel that tension with our daughter, that he might be at work there playing up our pride or-
Kari: … other things. Um, the Greek word for devil is Diabolos, and it means the one who divides. So, I’ve had to know if, if I’m feeling division, that he might be kind of tinkering up something here.
Kari: And to really lean into my faith and pray for God to help guide me to cho… make the right choices. Um, another important one is to, to know that every child and every parent is just one decision away from falling off a cliff. Every child is just one decision away from making their parents look like the worst parents on earth. And as we remember that we’re less likely to judge other parents whose kids have messed up.
Kari: We’re more likely to show mercy and you know, to walk through these, the fall outs with our children when they mess up, because we’ve got to admit that they’re human and we’re all sinful, and we all need a savior.
Kari: And that’s, and that’s probably the biggest parenting point of all is that we’re not meant to do this alone. And even our failures, because God is so good, he can use them for redemption and restoration and just sh- let us share the love of Christ to our children and to others.
Kari: I mean, that story I started the book with about me failing, I planned to never tell it to anybody.
Kari: And yet, five years later, is the opening to a book.
Kari: And to me, I’m like, God is so good. I never would have thought that this is where that story would go.
Jim: And Kari, I think, you know, the last obvious question is for that mom, where the relationship is broken. No, she’s headed into the closet with all that emotion and the tears of what is going on in this relationship. Everything I say is wrong, everything I do is wrong. And she just seems to hate me. What do you suggest to her to begin to change that?
Kari: Right. I just suggest that just to keep being proactive, keep loving your daughter, keep showing love even if it’s not reciprocated. But to do that, the mom has to be in a good place. Sometimes we’re relying on our daughters to make us feel good to give that love back and they’re not, or our-
Kari: … sons. And so that’s why we’ve got to have the love of our spouse, or if we’re not married, our friends or our therapist, or our parents or our coworkers to really invest in building a strong community of people who see the good in you, who encourage you, who know how hard you’re trying even though your child doesn’t. And just to pray, ask God like, God you, you see my faithfulness and I’m just trusting you with this child and our relationship, and just praying for the restoration there. But but don’t give up on your child or yourself or God-
Kari: … just keep doing that, because children are typically not going to come to us saying I want to have a stronger relationship. That it really is up to us as parents to build that bridge.
Kari: And just to keep trying. And one day, hopefully her daughter, you know, 20 years from now might be like, “Wow, my mom must have really loved me.” You know, once she’s in a more mature place to see that she kept loving me and trying even though I was being salty to her.
Kari: You know?
Jim: That’s good advice, Kari. And this has been so good. I hope encouraging, uh, to the moms in the audience. And wherever they’re at, uh, maybe they’re just in front of the teenage years. Or maybe they’re now into the 20 somethings, and they need to do some repair work. Uh, this is an excellent resource, your book, Love Her Well. I mean, that is… I think that’s God’s heart for your-
Jim: … relationship with your daughter as well. And of course, we have something here at Focus, John, Brio magazine for teen girls, uh, you know, a few years ago, we had to suspend that, we brought it back. And it’s a great tool when I’m traveling and talking to audiences, so many young women come up and will say to me, “You know, I’m a subscriber to Brio. And thank you for that magazine, it meant so much to me.” And so, I’d encourage you to consider getting a subscription to Brio magazine-
Jim: … for your teen girl. And then also, uh, obviously Kari’s great book, Love Her Well, if you can make a gift to Focus on the Family of any amount, we’ll send it as our way of saying thank you for being part of the ministry. If you can’t afford it, we say this often, John, uh, we want you to have this. So just get in touch with us, we’re gonna trust that others will cover that expense of ministering to you. So, thank you for your support in advance.
Jim: And Kari, thank you so much for being with us.
Kari: Thank you. This was awesome. I’ve loved… Like I said, I’ve loved your ministry for so long.
Jim: (Laughs). Praise God.
Kari: Yes. I mean, you just do wonderful work both of you.
Jim: Well, thank you.
John: And to get in touch with us, our number is 800, the letter A, in the word FAMILY, 800-232-6459, or stop by focusonthefamily.com/broadcast to donate and, uh, to get that book or to sign up for Brio magazine. And, uh, next time, we’ll have Dr. Kathryn Butler here offering a biblical perspective on end-of-life decisions.
Dr. Kathryn Butler: While death was never our original purpose. And it is wrong and it’s abhorrent and it’s the wages of our sin. The cross transforms death from something to be avoided at all costs to something that promises us hope.
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John: On behalf of Jim Daly and the entire team, thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family. I’m John Fuller, inviting you back as we once more help you and your family thrive in Christ.